The OLine with the most 1st team All Conference Players got beat by a 3 man rush by the Tulsa Crimson Tide , embarrassing
Jake Brown is Charmin Soft
Heupel Defenders
- Thread starter Stevieknight
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Jake Brown is Charmin Soft
I'm not sure which part you're trying to refute here. We've had many close calls over the past couple years, it wouldn't take much difference in QB play to see different results. Are you saying that we couldn't possibly be rebuilding because our oline got awards last season?
I'm ok hanging on to my beyond flawed logic for the time being.
I go back and forth. He's using players that were recruited for an option offense and they don't completely fit. The RBs are too small for what he does and the OL Is just not there right now. They have problems picking out where the rush is coming from. DG with a clean pocket and a working run game is different than what we saw last night. To me it all depends on how the OL is creating holes and pass blocking.
That's all fine and dandy, but the question is whether or not this offense will work even when/if CJH gets "his" guys.
and if it even fits the strengths of a Program that is located in the middle of Florida with undersized speed, especially in our current conference
There is also that big buyout to consider? Does UCF have that kind of cash?
I think you nailed it. You guys can thrive on smaller/faster players, especially on defense but for this offense to work he's going to need big bodied receivers who can fly, and those kinds of kids are going to P5 schools.
It will work if the offensive line is solid and can pick up where the rush is coming from. The three man rush worked to get massive holes for LBs to get through. OL didn't stay in position, and also got beat outright by three men a few times. If the RBs got 4-5 a carry, Tulsa has to bring in another DL and put more men in the box. Then the pass is open. To me, the quick fix for yesterday, Cincy and Pitt was Mack attack 9n the ground.
I like DG but CJHs decision to give him the team this soon was a big mistake. Mack and Wimbush should have been running this team regardless. We need a QB who knows how to bail from the pocket when our OL is collapsing.
I'm not saying playing DG was a bad idea, but we also have so much talent being wasted. And you say but DG can deliver the ball! I would respond part of it is that he has talent around him. What will happen when Davis, Williams and Nixon are gone? You risk putting DG in a position to fail later on.
DG should have been part of the new movement once Wimbush, KZ and Mack's years transitioned over. I would have accepted the growing pains then.
For everyone from the 2017 year, it has to be heartbreaking. This group deserves better. If CJH leaves for a big contract I wouldn't be upset.
I'm not saying playing DG was a bad idea, but we also have so much talent being wasted. And you say but DG can deliver the ball! I would respond part of it is that he has talent around him. What will happen when Davis, Williams and Nixon are gone? You risk putting DG in a position to fail later on.
DG should have been part of the new movement once Wimbush, KZ and Mack's years transitioned over. I would have accepted the growing pains then.
For everyone from the 2017 year, it has to be heartbreaking. This group deserves better. If CJH leaves for a big contract I wouldn't be upset.
According to this logic, Frost sucks as a coach as well and Milton just pasted over all his deficiencies. No Milton at Nebraska and they suck. So, instead of worrying about this and that when we lose, what everybody should be looking at is how staffs develop QBs. They make coaches look better than they are, and coaches look bad if they can’t develop the QB position.
Bill Belicheck had one season in like 16 years where Brady is hurt and they have to play another guy. Result....no playoffs. While coaching Cleveland....average at best. So is Belicheck really that good or does Brady just paste over all his deficiencies?
The part I am refuting.....not trying.......
Your response.......
The losing goes way beyond your claim of a FR QB..........the OL was outmatched and CJH was out coached.......and NOOOO, despite what you think and said, losing last night is a very big deal.......
Look, all the this and that, we should do this, we should do that, its baffling that we are even asking ourselves. I admit I have not been a big fan of JH thus far, but stopped short of saying I want him fired. That changed last night. Leaving DG in there last night was not only stupid, but reckless. And it was not the only dumb thing I've seen, but yeah that was enough for me.
You are way overthinking this and making it more complicated than it needs to be. Frost has nothing to do with this
CJH has a lot of deficiencies and is being outcoached
A great QB will make up for his mistakes. He’s been mediocre at best without KZ
DG makes a few more plays and we are undefeated. We still have the penalties, dropped kicks, poor offensive line play, etc being covered up
You’re right. It’s definitely a gimmick offense. At Mizzou they had two top 15 offenses, in 2018 they were ranked around #5 and in 2019 we are currently ranked #3.
A teams record doesn't always paint a clear picture. UCF, even with 3 or 4 plays going differently would not be an elite team even if that meant an undefeated record. Hell, my Huskers are 3 plays away from being 7-2 but that wouldn't mean they look like a division title contender.
It's not a gimmick offense, it's an offense that defensive coordinators figured out how to defend in 1996 and has become antiquated since then. Sure, if you get elite players it will work but that can be said of the veer or any other offense. All CJH has to do is find the next Randy Moss, emmitt smith, and Andre Ware and you guys will be set.
Not entirely true. They fired him after 3 seasons in which he lost 5 games twice and 7 his first year after a 13-1 season the year before. Holgorson already lost 6 and no one wants him fired. If we get 5 losses every year JH needs to go. Have to at least give him another season though.
He can run two plays at DD, run the coffee to you up the middle or toss it 60 yards at you
Great we have posters comparing CJH to Belichick.
I agree with you. If we were 10-0 with a few more good plays by the QB and it would be blasphemy to criticize a 10-0 team
The QB play would be creating a mirage and making the coach look good. Real knowledgeable fans know better
However, since we have 3 losses and one to Tulsa, hiding or explaining Heupel’s shortcomings won’t be necessary
That’s some funny shit. As long as he doesn’t throw a Coolatta screen pass to me 4 times in a row.
and it seems like Texas and up through Oklahoma natives are obsessed with it, think a lot of Texas HS run it too. Florida HS and Georgia run more Run Spread Options
Headline for a newspaper somewhere in Oklahoma next year reads
"JH burns more customers! Local donut shop forced to close."
Give him a hoodie and they are practically the same guy
danny white thought he had the formula with the former big 12 QB thing, but instead of getting another scott frost he got major applewhite.
Ohio State drubbing their conference-mate Maryland and doing an onside kick to get the ball back. Talk about going for the kill.
We need to be this cutthroat to USF
I agree. I'm not as concerned with freshman QB making freshman mistakes as I am about how soft our O and D lines are. Their QB had ALL DAY to throw, while ours was flushed out, sacked, hurried, etc. a LOT.
I'm not claiming that all problems are due to a freshman QB. I have clearly mentioned that we are rebuilding several times in this thread. But feel free to build a straw man if it makes you feel better.
You can also feel free to lose your shit over one game. You'll find plenty of friends on this board that way.
You seem to be completely convinced you're right and I'm ok agreeing to disagree. But I would encourage you not to mistake emotional opinions for facts.
Don't forget there are people who want Tulsa kicked out of the conference. I don't totally disagree for more reasons than football, but we've lost all room to talk since every time we walk on their field we catch a L.
Thanks, because I definitely have
However, I’m still tailgating and going to every game that I can. Hopefully better days are ahead
Without MM last year, UCF probably would have had 3 or 4 losses. He's a once in a generation player that can cover up a lot of deficiencies.
losing to them doesn't change my opinion that it's embarrassing to have them in the Conference, there were High School games 20 minutes from that stadium with better crowds
Wimbush and Mack could have done the same. Mack did so last year in limited time. Wimbush's ability to run would've bailed out a failing OL. I think we would have returned to an NY6 bowl (and probably lose) if we didn't start over.
Problem is, despite opportunities in my opinion, he’s just not using them enough. So. we have no idea
