Is Baseball in Trouble?

[bqknight]

The difference between what I posted and what Wayne "caught me" on was exactly 1 game. Wow!

Who exactly is being petty again?

PS- I noticed that everyone here sounding the alarm about "baseball being in trouble" conveniently avoided the fact that the USMNT did not even qualify for the WC. Seems to me that USA soccer is in much, much bigger trouble.

I was talking about you randomly bringing up their website...which looks like every other website from a professional sports team.

...and what does the USMNT not making the WC have to do with anything we're talking about? We had a sh!t coach and a President who overstayed his welcome (GOL style). The sport is still as popular as ever here, despite that.

 

[UCFWayne]

I was talking about you randomly bringing up their website...which looks like every other website from a professional sports team.

...and what does the USMNT not making the WC have to do with anything we're talking about? We had a sh!t coach and a President who overstayed his welcome (GOL style). The sport is still as popular as ever here, despite that.

soccer is more popular than ever in the us. i believe liga mx outdraws mlb on tv regularly. epl gets about the same as the nhl. 85 tries to tie soccer support in this country solely to mls and thats just wrong. of course mls is pretty new and not at the same level, that stuff takes time to build much like ucf vs the p5 argument. the only thing that sucks about not making the wc is that mls probably wont see as big of a ratings bump after the wc like it normally has. but mls doesnt need the usmnt to make the wc to continue to grow. its done that on its own over the past decade slowly but surely.

 

[Knight_Light]

Skipped over a few dozen posts but I think I got the just: Are we talking about struggling Muslim baseball teams and their attendance?

 

[UCFKnight85]

soccer is more popular than ever in the us. i believe liga mx outdraws mlb on tv regularly. epl gets about the same as the nhl. 85 tries to tie soccer support in this country solely to mls and thats just wrong. of course mls is pretty new and not at the same level, that stuff takes time to build much like ucf vs the p5 argument. the only thing that sucks about not making the wc is that mls probably wont see as big of a ratings bump after the wc like it normally has. but mls doesnt need the usmnt to make the wc to continue to grow. its done that on its own over the past decade slowly but surely.

Yea, totally disagree with that last part. FOX did not shell out massive amounts of money for nothing- the WC is one of the few times that millions of Americans watch soccer. To tell me there's no value to the MLS in that, or detriment when USMNT doesn't even make it, is totally wrong.

The EPL is pulling a respectable 420,000 average TV viewership but that still pales in comparison to the major sports in the US. The WC ratings dwarf that. If there was a time to inspire kids to keep going with soccer, it's the WC and it's probably because they're watching the USMNT.

Showing English teams on Saturday mornings is good business. It probably won't build soccer from the ground up in the US. The MLS ratings are Tuesday night MAC-esque. The WC and USMNT interest is undoubtedly one of the best tools to show kids AMERICAN soccer players.

 

[UCFWayne]

Yea, totally disagree with that last part. FOX did not shell out massive amounts of money for nothing- the WC is one of the few times that millions of Americans watch soccer. To tell me there's no value to the MLS in that, or detriment when USMNT doesn't even make it, is totally wrong.

The EPL is pulling a respectable 420,000 average TV viewership but that still pales in comparison to the major sports in the US. The WC ratings dwarf that. If there was a time to inspire kids to keep going with soccer, it's the WC and it's probably because they're watching the USMNT.

Showing English teams on Saturday mornings is good business. It probably won't build soccer from the ground up in the US. The MLS ratings are Tuesday night MAC-esque. The WC and USMNT interest is undoubtedly one of the best tools to show kids AMERICAN soccer players.

sure fox put a ton of money into the tv contract for wc but that doesnt affect the mls contract at all. sure mls normally sees a big boost in their ratings post wc. they probably will again this year as well, just not as big percentage wise as they have in the past. usmnt not making the world cup doesnt hurt the mls, it just doesnt help them as much.

idk where you get your epl tv numbers from, but they have averaged over 500k for the past few years. 2 years ago they were slightly higher than the nhl. last year the nhl was slightly higher. they are on par with each other.

i see that you didnt include the number one soccer league in the country. is that because it completely shatters any narrative that you have against soccer? liga mx averages above 1 million viewers.

the sport of soccer is among the top sports in this country. the support for soccer continues to grow. kids see this and over the coming years we will see more kids taking up soccer knowing it can pay just as much as the other sports in this country. this is not a dig at baseball.

 

[UCFKnight85]

sure fox put a ton of money into the tv contract for wc but that doesnt affect the mls contract at all. sure mls normally sees a big boost in their ratings post wc. they probably will again this year as well, just not as big percentage wise as they have in the past. usmnt not making the world cup doesnt hurt the mls, it just doesnt help them as much.

idk where you get your epl tv numbers from, but they have averaged over 500k for the past few years. 2 years ago they were slightly higher than the nhl. last year the nhl was slightly higher. they are on par with each other.

i see that you didnt include the number one soccer league in the country. is that because it completely shatters any narrative that you have against soccer? liga mx averages above 1 million viewers.

the sport of soccer is among the top sports in this country. the support for soccer continues to grow. kids see this and over the coming years we will see more kids taking up soccer knowing it can pay just as much as the other sports in this country. this is not a dig at baseball.

My EPL number came directly from this article on this very subject written just last year.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/107770250

To your last point- kids in America have always played soccer. It’s a bit youth sport. Soccer players overseas have always made a lot of money. That didn’t change the dynamic of pro soccer in America and it’s not going to change that any time soon, so long as MLS is still a minor league

 

[UCFWayne]

My EPL number came directly from this article on this very subject written just last year.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/107770250

To your last point- kids in America have always played soccer. It’s a bit youth sport. Soccer players overseas have always made a lot of money. That didn’t change the dynamic of pro soccer in America and it’s not going to change that any time soon, so long as MLS is still a minor league

ok so it was down 18% for 16-17 at 420k. i didnt realize it had slipped so much from the previous year of 514k. we will see how the 17-18 year ends up.

the difference is that big time soccer wasnt available on tv for kids to watch in the past. now they know there is a path to fame/fortune that they were unaware of in the past. thats why kids stopped playing soccer once they hit high school level. now there will be more kids that will feel they can stick with soccer and still achieve fame/fortune.

 

[sk8knight]

You have been non stop whining, literally ruining this board, about one thing you've claimed I have lied about on the UCF water cooler internet message board.

Meanwhile you've been praising Trump daily who has told one thousand four hundred and eighty six (as of this writing) documented lies as President of the United States of America.

There are no words in the english dictionary that can accurately describe just how stupid you are. The earth would be an inifinitely better place if you held the leader of the free world to just a tiny fraction of a percent of the standard you are trying to hold me to. You are literally pathetic.

source: http://projects.thestar.com/donald-trump-fact-check/

I was interested to see what that site was tracking so I clicked. The very first one is:
""Kim Strassel of the WSJ just said, after reviewing the dumb Comey Memos, 'you got to ask, what was the purpose of the Special Counsel? There's no there there.'
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Trump misquoted Strassel. Appearing on a Fox News show called Journal Editorial Report, Strassel did not say "you've got to ask, what was the purpose of the special counsel." In fact, she said "you've got to ask here what was the basis for a special counsel." Basis for, not purpose of. She also did not say "there's no there there"; she said "there's not a lot there there," a slightly less favourable assessment for Trump."

I think you're really stretching calling that a lie. Trump is not a lawyer that parses every single word for meaning. This looks much more like a slight misquoting than an intentional misquote meant to deceive. Or maybe the term that became fashionable during the Obama administration, he misspoke. I have to wonder how many of those 1100+ "lies" are really nothing more than innocent misquotes. How many of them are intentionally and blatantly uttering wildly false statements with the purpose to deceive?

 

[NinjaKnight]

I was interested to see what that site was tracking so I clicked. The very first one is:
""Kim Strassel of the WSJ just said, after reviewing the dumb Comey Memos, 'you got to ask, what was the purpose of the Special Counsel? There's no there there.'
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Trump misquoted Strassel. Appearing on a Fox News show called Journal Editorial Report, Strassel did not say "you've got to ask, what was the purpose of the special counsel." In fact, she said "you've got to ask here what was the basis for a special counsel." Basis for, not purpose of. She also did not say "there's no there there"; she said "there's not a lot there there," a slightly less favourable assessment for Trump."

I think you're really stretching calling that a lie. Trump is not a lawyer that parses every single word for meaning. This looks much more like a slight misquoting than an intentional misquote meant to deceive. Or maybe the term that became fashionable during the Obama administration, he misspoke. I have to wonder how many of those 1100+ "lies" are really nothing more than innocent misquotes. How many of them are intentionally and blatantly uttering wildly false statements with the purpose to deceive?

That's why the site has this disclaimer at the very top:

If Trump is a serial liar, why call this a list of “false claims,” not lies? The answer is that we can’t be sure that each and every one was intentional. In some cases, he may have been confused or ignorant. What we know, objectively, is that he was not telling the truth.

 

[sk8knight]

That's why the site has this disclaimer at the very top:

If Trump is a serial liar, why call this a list of “false claims,” not lies? The answer is that we can’t be sure that each and every one was intentional. In some cases, he may have been confused or ignorant. What we know, objectively, is that he was not telling the truth.

Not being correct is different than lying. Lying requires intent to deceive. That's why it has such a negative connotation.

I had to stop reading it because it is ridiculously slanted garbage.

Spoiler

I got to the 3rd one in the list where they are showing their ignorance about how classified information works:
"
"'At least two Memos Comey shared with a friend contained Classified Information.' Wall Street Journal."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

in fact: Trump misquoted the Wall Street Journal in a way that made Comey seem worse. The actual sentence in the Journal read: "At least two of the memos that former FBI Director James Comey gave to a friend outside of the government contained information that officials now consider classified, according to people familiar with the matter, prompting a review by the Justice Department's internal watchdog." Trump omitted a central part of the report: the inquiry is over material in these two memos that officials "now" consider classified, not necessarily information that was classified at the time. (In fact, the next paragraph of the Journal report goes as follows: "Of those two memos, Mr. Comey himself redacted elements of one that he knew to be classified to protect secrets before he handed the documents over to his friend. He determined at the time that another memo contained no classified information, but after he left the Federal Bureau of Investigation, bureau officials upgraded it to "confidential," the lowest level of classification.")"

There is no "now considered classified." The information was classified in nature whether it was marked so or not. It's the great lie that started with the Hillary server. What they are saying here is that Comey recorded information that should've been classified given the nature and source and he well knew that it should've been classified, then violated the law by not marking the documents as classified (including section markings), violated the law by sharing the classified information with another person with the intent of disseminating it further, and stripped information from a classified document without a declassification review and then shared that information (which should've still been deemed classified). The FBI has had committes of lawyers redacting documents they are court-ordered to produce to groups like Congress and Judicial Watch, but here "straight-shooter" Comey is single-handedly determining this because it fits his purpose.

 

[NinjaKnight]

Not being correct is different than lying. Lying requires intent to deceive. That's why it has such a negative connotation.

I agree, much of these statements by trump are not lies, but they aren't true. But I'm not sure which is worse, mass incompentence, or mass lying. Trump seems to be doing plenty of both though.

 

[UCFKnight85]

ok so it was down 18% for 16-17 at 420k. i didnt realize it had slipped so much from the previous year of 514k. we will see how the 17-18 year ends up.

the difference is that big time soccer wasnt available on tv for kids to watch in the past. now they know there is a path to fame/fortune that they were unaware of in the past. thats why kids stopped playing soccer once they hit high school level. now there will be more kids that will feel they can stick with soccer and still achieve fame/fortune.

I will say NBC does a good job with EPL. And filling weekend mornings with "something" is a good idea since it's a dead period on air.

 

[1ofTheseKnights]

 

[The Branch]

Title of this thread ... "is baseball in trouble?"

 

[sk8knight]

Title of this thread ... "is baseball in trouble?"

It's called a thread-jack. Duh.