Two more tankers attacked off Iran's coast

Discussion in 'The Water Cooler' started by UCFKnight85, Jun 13, 2019.

  1. Ace of Knights

    Ace of Knights Silver Knight
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    It’s wrong up until the point they were told to do it. But It has been done in the past. And it’s plausible knowing that direct talks between the U.S. and Iran are not happening that the U.S. let The NY Times put this out there knowing it would be read internationally as a means to try and cool this situation.

    And The NY Times would be the paper to do it with because they’re viewed as credible outside the U.S.

    I tend to agree with you, that’s not why this was done, but it’s possible. We’ll never know.
     
  2. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    I'm not a lawyer but I have to imagine that information like this is billed as Top Secret and I have to imagine that the press running it even at the request of the WH would be not only very harmful but potentially illegal.
     
  3. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    Listen, I'm only going to explain this one more time.

    I do not want Trump re-elected. I actually think Biden would be a better President. I may vote for Biden, if he gets the nomination, out of the same respect I voted for Dole, the only time I voted Republican, back in '96.

    But you 3rd grader Progressives, and your commonly dead wrong US News Media, are giving moderates and even critically thinking Liberals so much reason to vote 'against' you, because you keep 'labeling' and 'stereotyping' everyone to an level, that you're catching registered Democratic voters too!

    Because your comments, like the US News Media, are just as wrong as Trump most times, let alone you create 'narratives' about what Trump said -- just like Biden recently, I might add -- not actually what Trump said (or Biden recently), which are easily disproven by looking at actual transcripts.

    Thus, they feel there is 'no way out' but to vote 'for the other side,' to stop the mass destruction of everyone that doesn't 100% agree with you, let alone openly questions why 30%+ of the country are racists, when it's actually under 3%.

    I mean, look at the Trump demographics! More African-Americans and Hispanic-Americans 'shifted' than people in the US News Media like to admit, for a Republican. Don't ignore it, look at it!

    Seriously, this is getting old. You're the exact person that got Trump elected. You fail to understand that, and it's your continued undoing.
     
  4. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    At least Pelosi hasn't been spewing the rhetoric.
    She knows Trump doesn't want to go to war with Iran.

    Now if the 3rd graders would stop pushing the idea that Trump is a hawk (let alone forgetting Clinton very much was a hawk!), we could move forward.
    I'm just hoping Trump realizes that there are limits to appeasing the Saudis.
     
  5. sk8knight

    sk8knight Golden Knight
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    You’re assuming a few things here that present an idealistic hope where reality is probably different.

    First, you’re assuming that the people at those installations are even aware of a potential threat must less a stand-down order. Their regime keeps the channels of information pretty close and it’s very likely they have no situational awareness beyond what they’re fed. They may even believe that the US lacks the capability to harm them.

    Second, you are assuming that they see this as a reprieve rather than a sign of weakness. Guarantee the regime is spinning that we backed down and validated their strength. While we see things through a western pro-America prism, they most assuredly do not.

    I would love for us to win the people and back a real revolution in Iran, but I just don’t see it coming.
     
  6. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    Just a reminder that Iran launched a missile at our drone through extremely busy airspace. I've flown into the UAE countless times and you almost always head straight down the Straight and incoming planes from India or the east would be flying straight through the space where the Drone was operating.

    I've actually been on planes who circled over Iran while waiting on Dubai airspace.

    So yea, Iran is also endangering innocent lives and creating a possibly Malaysian 17 situation due to their wreckless attacks on US military assets.
     
  7. ucflee

    ucflee Bronze Knight
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    The only target w/o ADS-B Out?*
     
  8. Ace of Knights

    Ace of Knights Silver Knight
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    It would most likely be TS-SCI for top secret specially compartmented Information. The leak would be someone of significance, like way up the ranks. Which is why it may have been communicated through the media on purpose.
     
  9. UCFWayne

    UCFWayne Diamond Knight
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    im glad trump called it off. i dont want another war. im hoping cooler heads prevail in the future.
     
  10. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    I love that Fox News hired Dr. Grant, as they have been bringing on a lot of moderates and even left-leaning analysis beyond their past 'token Liberals' of the past.

    She lays it out, plain and simple ...
    • QUOTE: "The Triton is not your backyard drone ... a wingspan of 130 feet and at 32,000 lbs., it weighs as much as a city bus or Class 7 truck."
    • QUOTE: "The Triton didn’t need to loop over Iran’s land mass to carry out its overwater mission."
    • QUOTE: "This surveillance asset posed absolutely no threat of any kind to Iran. Except, of course, for revealing Iran’s naval activity."
    • QUOTE: "Aerial surveillance is already making a difference. German Chancellor Angela Merkel ... acknowledged “strong evidence” of Iran’s involvement in the tanker shipping attacks."
    • QUOTE: "Today, other drones like the MQ-9 Reaper – Iran shot at one last week – provide full motion video of Iran’s naval activity."
    Wake up people. This is what we didn't have back in the '80s during the Iran-Iraq war. Iran has been trying to knock-down 100% recon-only aircraft over International Waters.

    Why is that? Why?
     
    250 UCFBS, Jun 21, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  11. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    BTW, regarding the NYTimes article, wwo (2) things here ...

    One (1), Iran is full of BS ...
    QUOTE: “At 00:14 US drone took off from UAE in stealth mode & violated Iranian airspace"

    The Triton outweighs small manned bombers is wider than a jumbo jet ... all while unmanned with 0 need for human support. It's a platform of strategic recon, not a 'stealth' aircraft and has absolutely no stealth profile. It would never fly over land, without the airspace owner's permission, for that reason, much less heavily defended Iranian airspace.

    Two (2), I fully suspect this was a 'test run.'

    I.e., the next time the Iranians do this, it's going to be full-on SEAD -- Supression of Enemy Air Defenses. The US is going to neuter their ability to shoot down anything in the gulf, in one, massive swoop. That requires combat readiness and practice ... and the DoD had the President implement this, then called it off. Why? To gauge military readiness under the assumption it was 'for real,' so they could 'correct deficiencies.' Why?

    Because the next time, again ... it will be SEAD ... for real.

    EDIT: It wouldn't surprise me if Pelosi, as well as the minority leader of the Senate, were in the room after the 'call off' for Trump to inform them, "There will be no resolution. The next time they shoot something down, this is the plan. Backstab me all you want, you now know the plan, and cannot claim you didn't know. This is how it must be, and Iran now knows it will becoming, no 'sneak attack,' they know what we'll put up to suppress everything they've got on the Gulf."

    This is Libya '86, only even closer and more direct justification than Reagan ever had.
     
    251 UCFBS, Jun 21, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
  12. ucfversusbcs

    ucfversusbcs Golden Knight
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    Lol the leverage is soooo real.
     
  13. fried-chicken

    fried-chicken Golden Knight
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    Then why do you hold the NYT accountable but give a pass to the shit show that is the Trump Admin.

    The NYT was given this info almost immediately. That's not a NYT problem it's a white house problem.
     
  14. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    I've already said that TDS traitors who are leaking, and have been leaking, should be dealt with criminally.

    And yes it's still a NYT problem. A newspaper that valued national security over tearing down Trump wouldn't have run that info.
     
  15. fried-chicken

    fried-chicken Golden Knight
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    Trump can't run an administration. Between people leaving and backstabbing and leaking and getting fired and going to jail, this is the worst run admin we may have ever had.
     
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  16. NinjaKnight

    NinjaKnight Todd's Tiki Bar
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    Easily the most dysfunctional in my memory
     
  17. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    Maybe if he had less left wing traitors to deal with?
     
  18. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    By the way, have the TDS nuts accepted that Iran blew up those tankers yet or is this conspiracy theory still going?
     
  19. DaShuckster

    DaShuckster Silver Knight
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    LOL Yeah, it's a real mystery why some folks -- including many of our allies -- had to see verifiable proof it was the Iranians.

    The only possible explanation is TDS, right guys? :joy:
     
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  20. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    Could always adopt the Obama administration plan to 'catch traitors' ...
    • Wiretap all press phones
    • When rumors start, claim you only did it to Fox News, as they aren't a real news organization
    • Draft an Executive Order preventing the next Presidency from doing so, in case a Republican retakes the White House
    • If not, enjoy 4 years of no scrutiny until after you're re-elected
    • Ignore it when it finally comes out, hope the non-Fox News press doesn't care
    • Finally implement Executive Order on your way out
    • Criticize the next administration for repealing the Executive Order
    That's how this works.
     
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  21. NinjaKnight

    NinjaKnight Todd's Tiki Bar
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  22. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    Geez, can the US News Media ever give Trump a break?

    You prepare for war, and you weigh the costs. Trump decided to be transparent. And this is the 'thanks' we give him?

    If this was Clinton, it would have been done by now.
     
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  23. DaShuckster

    DaShuckster Silver Knight
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    Funny how Trump decides to be transparent when it involves self-congratulations. :)
     
  24. Ucfmikes

    Ucfmikes Golden Knight
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    Hmm. If my memory serves me correctly, when in history did our allies ever believe anything without proof? :rolleyes: So.. this just started after Trump became president?

    Additionally, are you now finally admitting that there IS proof without personally needing to verify it by given access to classified files?
     
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  25. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    Sure enough, Reason.COM is on the pulse of Libertarians. Clinton, like the 4 Presidents prior, would have unleashed them.

    Trump Is Right: Killing Innocent Iranians Would Be a 'Not Proportionate' Response to Downed Drone
    Trump says he called off a planned airstrike against Iran on Thursday night, just minutes before the bombs were to be let loose.
    https://reason.com/2019/06/21/trump...a-not-proportionate-response-to-downed-drone/

    'Unfortunately, the four men who occupied the White House before Trump have eroded that morality to the point where dropping bombs on the Middle East and Central Asia has become a reflexive action ... Trump lived up to the non-interventionist message he delivered to voters in 2016. Remember, Trump won the White House by directly defeating the heirs to the Clinton- and Bush-era foreign policy disasters that have cost America and the Middle East so much blood and treasure.

    "Look, I said I want to get out of these endless wars, I campaigned on that, I want to get out," he told reporters in the Oval Office on Thursday, according to Politico. "We didn't have a man or woman in the drone. It would have made a big, big difference." The president has reportedly sought counsel from others who are skeptical of additional foreign conflicts, such as Sen. Rand Paul (R–Ky.) and Fox News host Tucker Carlson, even as other Trump allies like Bolton, Sen. Lindsey Graham (R–S.C.) and Sen. Tom Cotton (R–Ark.) have been beating the drums of war."'
     
  26. NinjaKnight

    NinjaKnight Todd's Tiki Bar
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  27. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    He's a goddamn idiot just like the other braindead TDS folks
     
  28. Ucfmikes

    Ucfmikes Golden Knight
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    Ok. So.. you’re saying that our president is egotistical. We all know this. What is your point?

    Who gives a crap.

    Oh.. in other breaking news professor Ninjaknight, water is wet!

    “Fuking, inbred, stupid, MAGA hat. :joy::joy::joy:

    “Why do I constantly have to keep explaining this to you goddamn morons and idiots!”
     
    268 Ucfmikes, Jun 22, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2019
  29. Crazyhole

    Crazyhole Golden Knight
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    Isn't the most important thing to take from this is that Trump proved he isn't a war monger who wants to start another war in the middle East? We demonstrated that we can and will respond in a big way if they keep it up but we don't want to if at all possible.

    This to me is a "you've got one more chance to clean up your act" type of thing. I used the friends at the bar metaphor a couple of weeks ago and was giving Trump grief for being the guy who talks crap and starts a fight, but with this act he became the badass guy who sits there having a good time but when the first punch is thrown he beats the hell out of everyone.
     
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  30. NinjaKnight

    NinjaKnight Todd's Tiki Bar
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    I'll agree with this. It was the right course of action to not escalate, I'm very happy with Trump's decision to go with a non kinetic response. Luckily for us all he's not listening to 85's idiot ass.

    It was stupid to frame it in a "changed my mind at the last second" though.
     
  31. Crazyhole

    Crazyhole Golden Knight
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    Maybe. The alternatives would have been to either deny any of it happened, or to just say it wasn't a real attack plan to begin with. It's entirely possible and maybe probable that this was leaked on purpose so he could get his message out, which is actually a pretty good tactic. The world now knows that he's serious about beating ass but doesn't want to if we can avoid it. If this is the case, it's a way better strategy than any of his 4 predecessors. I'll give GHWB the benefit of the doubt because he was responding to an act of outright war and we were in a better position financially then, the others since him escalated way beyond what should have happened and risked way too much.
     
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  32. NinjaKnight

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    lol I really just don't understand how people think "oh I changed my mind" = he's serious.

    Its such a pathetically obvious low IQ tactic, I guess I forget how dumb people are that they fall for this stuff.

    It is unequivocally a bad move. If you have new info, then yes by all means change your tactic to suit this new information. But to use mood swings to change your decision shows that you make bad decisions at first.
     
  33. Ucfmikes

    Ucfmikes Golden Knight
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    Trump did the right thing. Apparently, Iran didn’t shoot down a manned plane near the drone.

    We aren’t killing a bunch of people for a drone

    What scares me Iran’s technology, large military, and widespread terrorist network

    Let them bomb Israel. That would be idiotic.

    That will be the end of Iran as the people will be so outraged.

    Israel doesn’t give a fukc.
     
  34. YourWifesBoyfriend

    YourWifesBoyfriend Four-Star Recruit
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    why did you want to bomb the brown people so bad?
     
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  35. UCFKnight85

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    Maxine Waters pushes Iranian propaganda as a sitting US Congresswoman

    Fuking disgrace

     
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  36. NinjaKnight

    NinjaKnight Todd's Tiki Bar
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    Your own president did the exact same thing you stupid bitch.

    Remember when he took Russia's word on election interference over literally the entire US intelligence community. Zero outrage from you over that.
     
  37. GatorBull325

    GatorBull325 Three-Star Recruit
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    @UCFBS

    This shall be my final post. This website didn’t even allow me to reply for like 3 days

    1. In the end the CIA pulled a TRIFLING move in over throwing the Iranian gov’t. THE US was WRONG in what they did and that event led to where we are now. I don’t care who else was involved we should have NEVER done it in the 1st place. The CIA helped overthrow their gov't in 1953 and that started all of this bullcrapazoid

    2. Who cares what Germany or France did? What the h**ll does this have to do with what I posted? In the end we JOINED FORCES with SADDAM HUSSEIN/Iraq when he WAGED WAR against Iran. Funny how we ended up going to war with Saddam years later. Like the cliché’ says, “if you lay with dogs you are bound to catch fleas”. Same thing happened in Afghanistan when we joined forces with the Taliban to help them defeat Russia.

    3. The US was an ALLY, BUDDY, HOMEBOY, and FRIEND to Iraq when they waged war against Iran. You can pretend they knew nothing about the chemical attacks, but in the end, they joined forces with an evil regime that used chemical weapons against their opponent. Maybe if they didn’t join forces with an evil regime and stayed out of it, I wouldn’t be typing this up.

    4. In the end our great military “ACCIDENTALLY” killed 290 innocent people in which 66 were kids and paid a large settlement. The over aggressive coward named William C. Rogers III was the captain of the USS Vincernes. Rogers was personally criticized for being overly aggressive by Commander David Carlson, commanding officer of the USS Sides, a second ship that was under the tactical control of Rogers at the time of the incident. Carlson claimed that the downing of Iran Air 655 marked the "horrifying climax to Capt. Rogers' aggressiveness,

    5. The attack on the oil tanker was reported to have came from the air by the people on the ship – FACTS!!!The US just “happened” to have a drone in that area that Iran tried to shoot down b4 the event took place. This whole incident benefits the US b/c they do not want Japan or anybody buying oil from Iran. Which to me,Embargoes go against America’s “Freedom’ narrative b/c we aren’t giving other countries “FREEDOM” to trade with whomever they want to trade with. We are saying they do not have the freedom and using sanctions to bully other countries. But it's cool, one day all of these other countries will tell us to shove our sanctions in our a.$$ and will simply trade among themselves or China will fill that void.[/QUOTE]
     
    277 GatorBull325, Jun 24, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2019
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  38. UCFWayne

    UCFWayne Diamond Knight
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  39. UCFKnight85

    UCFKnight85 GOL's Inner Circle
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    [/QUOTE]

    Jesus Christ, you're on unhinged conspiracy theorist. And you're suspiciously willing to put forth Iranian propaganda as fact here. Makes you wonder.

    I like how you said "accidentally" when talking about the aircraft shot down. You want us to believe that the US military operated as terrorists and were in the business of taking down commercial airliners. What a sick, insane thing to say.
     
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  40. UCFBS

    UCFBS Diamond Knight
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    Yes, we did, and it was a mistake! It was yet another example of us supporting British Imperialism. And we said as much when we refused to go along with them in 1956.

    The fallout of the 1956 Suez Incident is why the US has been obligated to protect the sealanes in the Gulf, something so many of us Libertarians want to stop doing altogether. Apparently Trump is asking the same question too. ;)

    Because it means the UNSC is useless as other countries serve their selfish interests first. They were also the 2 countries that helped Iraq far more than the US during the Iraq-Iran war.

    Singapore, Germany and France were far more behind supplying them than the US. Read up!

    This is what pisses me off most, the US is a minority party, and other countries were doing far more, but we only criticize the US?

    Yes, he made a great scapegoat after US ships were getting attacked by various countries. Man, you really are ignorant. This came up repeatedly.

    Had another US vessel been attacked, on his watch, he'd be put up for a Court Marshall as well. You had to know the environment back then. It was worst than today.

    And the whole reason we're flying drones now, watching everything! I still cannot believe people wonder why we are.

    So in the same regard, wouldn't you agree with Trump ...

    Just WTF is the US doing enforcing 'freedom of navigation' in the Gulf? We should reverse course from after the 1956 Suez Incident, as even Trump is now saying.

    Don't you agree?
     

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