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What exactly is the middle class these days?

I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
 
Upper class - that asshole over there with the 5 cars, 2 wives and trophy girlfriend with the fake boobs.

Middle class - me and all of my friends (even if my friends are rich or poor)

Lower class - Either, those poor bastards that go to my kid's school. I feel so bad for them. Maybe I could donate a coat or something for them this winter. OR Those freeloading, Obama Phone getting leaches. My tax dollars are paying for them to eat lobster.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
 
I think this picture is somewhat accurate.
United_States_Class_Structure_Comparison,1984-2014.jpg


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_middle_class
 
Originally posted by USFSucks:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Originally posted by USFSucks:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
It's all relative. I would hardly call myself upper class but compared to you 85 I'm in the upper .000000001%.
 
Originally posted by Sir Galahad:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:

Originally posted by USFSucks:



Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
It's all relative. I would hardly call myself upper class but compared to you 85 I'm in the upper .000000001%.
Right you're the best message board millionaire that we've ever had. We're all in awe of your extensive wealth*
 
The middle class is the place where millions of Americans used to live, before finally giving up on ever finding full time decent work, and deciding to live a life of poorness.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Originally posted by USFSucks:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
Is $70K a year getting a family everything they need today compared to what middle-class families had 30+ years ago?

I'm not trying to start any debate here, just raising a question. In my eyes, a family bringing in $70K isn't living all that comfortably now adays. New cars are over $15K, homes mostly over $200K, food prices are up, gas, childcare, education, healthcare, etc...
Even being "middle-class" doesn't really cut it anymore.
 
Originally posted by chemmie:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:

Originally posted by USFSucks:



Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
Is $70K a year getting a family everything they need today compared to what middle-class families had 30+ years ago?

I'm not trying to start any debate here, just raising a question. In my eyes, a family bringing in $70K isn't living all that comfortably now adays. New cars are over $15K, homes mostly over $200K, food prices are up, gas, childcare, education, healthcare, etc...
Even being "middle-class" doesn't really cut it anymore.
$70K as a household income for 1-2 kids is doable if you live in Florida. I know people who are doing it right now.

But yes, it's tight. There's little room for error and it really makes saving/investing difficult.

I recently saw a graph that said the majority of low and middle income people have 90% of their wealth in their home, whereas people in the top 20% have the wealth spread out (where the home is less than 30% of their wealth), and the top 5% barely factor their home into their total wealth.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Originally posted by chemmie:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:

Originally posted by USFSucks:



Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
Is $70K a year getting a family everything they need today compared to what middle-class families had 30+ years ago?

I'm not trying to start any debate here, just raising a question. In my eyes, a family bringing in $70K isn't living all that comfortably now adays. New cars are over $15K, homes mostly over $200K, food prices are up, gas, childcare, education, healthcare, etc...
Even being "middle-class" doesn't really cut it anymore.
$70K as a household income for 1-2 kids is doable if you live in Florida. I know people who are doing it right now.

But yes, it's tight. There's little room for error and it really makes saving/investing difficult.

I recently saw a graph that said the majority of low and middle income people have 90% of their wealth in their home, whereas people in the top 20% have the wealth spread out (where the home is less than 30% of their wealth), and the top 5% barely factor their home into their total wealth.
Doesn't that raise a red flag to you? That the bottom 70% of people (roughly) can barely afford to save anything for their retirement because they are just making ends meet? This isn't poor people "freeloading" or whatever, these are normal working people. Teachers, firemen, police, etc.
 
Originally posted by chemmie:

Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Originally posted by USFSucks:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
Is $70K a year getting a family everything they need today compared to what middle-class families had 30+ years ago?

I'm not trying to start any debate here, just raising a question. In my eyes, a family bringing in $70K isn't living all that comfortably now adays. New cars are over $15K, homes mostly over $200K, food prices are up, gas, childcare, education, healthcare, etc...
Even being "middle-class" doesn't really cut it anymore.
A family of four could live pretty comfortably on 70K imo. They shouldn't be buying $200K homes. The first few years out of college I was making less than 30K until my sales picked up. I had a mortgage and truck payment and all the other stuff and was fine. The problem is no one knows how to budget anymore and keep spending until the checking account is at zero on payday. It costs about $5k per kid per year and the govt gives you $4k of that.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Originally posted by Sir Galahad:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:

Originally posted by USFSucks:



Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
I don't know, but I'm still tickled when people claim that $150-200K salary is middle class.
Well, then be tickled. I don't think a $150-$200k salary is upper class by any stretch of the imagination.
Unfortuantely your opinion is negated by virtually every analysis of this topic.

150K puts you in the 85th percentile. $200K puts you in the 96th percentile.

The "middle" aka the 20th to 60th percentile, spans between $20K per year to $70K per year.
It's all relative. I would hardly call myself upper class but compared to you 85 I'm in the upper .000000001%.
Right you're the best message board millionaire that we've ever had. We're all in awe of your extensive wealth*
It all depends on how you calculate wealth. First let me say that message board has nothing do with my wealth, second, I would hardly call myself rich.
 
Bob come back when you have two kids and a wife.

Daycare = $150 per week per kid. That is $7,200 just so you can get to work. Activities all run $100 per month for sports or ballet or stuff like that. You still have to feed them and clothe them.

Older kids? The schools hit you up for $100 a month minimum for donations fees or field trips. Sports are $200 every couple of months and clothes are more expensive the taller they get.

Live in Orlando and homes are $200k or rent at $1500 to $1700 a month for a three bedroom that you need with 4 people in your family. $70k is tough but not impossible if you live like our parents did with eating at home instead of out and going on modest vacations.
 
Originally posted by Game_Day_Sports:
Bob come back when you have two kids and a wife.

Daycare = $150 per week per kid. That is $7,200 just so you can get to work. Activities all run $100 per month for sports or ballet or stuff like that. You still have to feed them and clothe them.

Older kids? The schools hit you up for $100 a month minimum for donations fees or field trips. Sports are $200 every couple of months and clothes are more expensive the taller they get.

Live in Orlando and homes are $200k or rent at $1500 to $1700 a month for a three bedroom that you need with 4 people in your family. $70k is tough but not impossible if you live like our parents did with eating at home instead of out and going on modest vacations.
I wish I could find daycare for $150/wk.
 
Originally posted by UCFRogerz:
I wish I could find daycare for $150/wk.
No doubt. We pay a little over $32k a year here in Chapel Hill for 2 kids, which I believe works out to ~$670.00 per week.
 
Originally posted by Game_Day_Sports:
Bob come back when you have two kids and a wife.

Daycare = $150 per week per kid. That is $7,200 just so you can get to work. Activities all run $100 per month for sports or ballet or stuff like that. You still have to feed them and clothe them.

Older kids? The schools hit you up for $100 a month minimum for donations fees or field trips. Sports are $200 every couple of months and clothes are more expensive the taller they get.

Live in Orlando and homes are $200k or rent at $1500 to $1700 a month for a three bedroom that you need with 4 people in your family. $70k is tough but not impossible if you live like our parents did with eating at home instead of out and going on modest vacations.
Or you could live like their parents and not have a 3 bedroom house with 4 people and not shuffle your kids off to dance and whatever else and oh by the way not need daycare because you've only got one parent working or your parents live with or near you. Let's all be honest, damn near every person in America enjoys a much better life than 60 years ago. It's just that we strive for so much more or feel we're somehow entitled to it. At some point, it's going to collapse on us.
 
Originally posted by sk8knight:


Originally posted by Game_Day_Sports:
Bob come back when you have two kids and a wife.

Daycare = $150 per week per kid. That is $7,200 just so you can get to work. Activities all run $100 per month for sports or ballet or stuff like that. You still have to feed them and clothe them.

Older kids? The schools hit you up for $100 a month minimum for donations fees or field trips. Sports are $200 every couple of months and clothes are more expensive the taller they get.

Live in Orlando and homes are $200k or rent at $1500 to $1700 a month for a three bedroom that you need with 4 people in your family. $70k is tough but not impossible if you live like our parents did with eating at home instead of out and going on modest vacations.
Or you could live like their parents and not have a 3 bedroom house with 4 people and not shuffle your kids off to dance and whatever else and oh by the way not need daycare because you've only got one parent working or your parents live with or near you. Let's all be honest, damn near every person in America enjoys a much better life than 60 years ago. It's just that we strive for so much more or feel we're somehow entitled to it. At some point, it's going to collapse on us.
Agreed, sk8. My parents were pretty poor while I was growing up and I am always amazed at how well they did with their extremely limited income. My mother could swallow a penny and sh!t a mile long wire strand. I don't think I could do it since I've developed some relatively "bad" lifestyle spending habits over the years as my income rose.

If I had lived as frugally and had been able to save as well as my parents did, I'd easily be a retired millionaire by now.
 
My dad worked days and my mom nights, no need for day care. We lived in a 1600 sq ft house, no need for a $200k house just to keep up with the Jones'. We rarely ever went out to dinner. A DINC making $70,000 don't really have good jobs so they are not tied to living in an expensive area.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Once again, it depends on what you call middle class. Some people call middle class being able to do things for their kids like sports and dance class, live in a nice house and go on a vacation once a year. I don't see that as something that is asking too much and a family making $75,000 to $100,000 would fit that description. Now that same family making $300,000 a year does not make them rich, it just makes them upper middle class. I have always said, if you need to work to continue your lifestyle, you're not rich.
 
chemmie- here is the problem. Most people ARE wreckless and stupid with money, and put themselves in the financial holes that they're in.

Just today in the TBO I read a story about a poor single mother who could barely make ends meat- and then I read that she has 13 kids. 13!! At some point, don't you think this woman should have cut off the baby making tubes if she realized that it might be hard to make it financially?

I know a guy who is making probably $55k a year, no kids, yet he's living tight financially because he thought it'd be a good idea to buy a new $29K car and finance most all of it. Him doing that has probably killed his dreams of buying a house now.

There were people making over $200K per year in 2008 who went tits up after the recession hit, simply because they spent and went into debt not thinking about saving or investing. $200K yet living paycheckt to paycheck.
 
The middle class used to be, what most Americans hoped to work their way up and out of. Today it is what they hope they can work themselves up to.
 
Originally posted by Sir Galahad:
Once again, it depends on what you call middle class. Some people call middle class being able to do things for their kids like sports and dance class, live in a nice house and go on a vacation once a year. I don't see that as something that is asking too much and a family making $75,000 to $100,000 would fit that description. Now that same family making $300,000 a year does not make them rich, it just makes them upper middle class. I have always said, if you need to work to continue your lifestyle, you're not rich.
How many times are you going to say things like this against all facts and studies?

I don't give a shit what you do or don't want to do with your money. I'm only looking at the statistical facts of what income is concentrated where in this country and in what percentile.

You're delusional and ignorant if you think that $300K per year is "upper middle class". A household income of $300K statistically puts someone in the 98th percentile in the US. Which of course means that a whopping 2% of the country makes more than them.

There's nothing middle class about that. You see, to be "middle class", you need to have an income that is actually in the middle percentile of what the country makes.

$300K per year is statistically amongst the wealthiest in the entire nation. Upper, upper class at best.

We can never have a rationale debate on this subject if clowns like you keep insisting that ultra wealthy people are in fact in the middle class.
 
Originally posted by sk8knight:

Originally posted by Game_Day_Sports:
Bob come back when you have two kids and a wife.

Daycare = $150 per week per kid. That is $7,200 just so you can get to work. Activities all run $100 per month for sports or ballet or stuff like that. You still have to feed them and clothe them.

Older kids? The schools hit you up for $100 a month minimum for donations fees or field trips. Sports are $200 every couple of months and clothes are more expensive the taller they get.

Live in Orlando and homes are $200k or rent at $1500 to $1700 a month for a three bedroom that you need with 4 people in your family. $70k is tough but not impossible if you live like our parents did with eating at home instead of out and going on modest vacations.
Or you could live like their parents and not have a 3 bedroom house with 4 people and not shuffle your kids off to dance and whatever else and oh by the way not need daycare because you've only got one parent working or your parents live with or near you. Let's all be honest, damn near every person in America enjoys a much better life than 60 years ago. It's just that we strive for so much more or feel we're somehow entitled to it. At some point, it's going to collapse on us.
Some people have no control over where their parents live (or if they are even still alive) and might need a second income to make ends meet. It's not always as easy as some make it out to be. And there is nothing wrong with having your kids involved in something (not everything) but something. It's all about choices and living within one's means to the best of their ability.
 
85 is such an idiot. I make $500k per year, but that is definitely middle class. Where does $500k on the scale of $0 and $1,000,000? THE MIDDLE! Idiot.

If you think you could have 4 kids, 4 cars, a lake house, a vacation house, take 4 vacations year, and not live paycheck to paycheck of $500k then you are full of d doo.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:

Originally posted by Sir Galahad:
Once again, it depends on what you call middle class. Some people call middle class being able to do things for their kids like sports and dance class, live in a nice house and go on a vacation once a year. I don't see that as something that is asking too much and a family making $75,000 to $100,000 would fit that description. Now that same family making $300,000 a year does not make them rich, it just makes them upper middle class. I have always said, if you need to work to continue your lifestyle, you're not rich.
How many times are you going to say things like this against all facts and studies?

I don't give a shit what you do or don't want to do with your money. I'm only looking at the statistical facts of what income is concentrated where in this country and in what percentile.

You're delusional and ignorant if you think that $300K per year is "upper middle class". A household income of $300K statistically puts someone in the 98th percentile in the US. Which of course means that a whopping 2% of the country makes more than them.

There's nothing middle class about that. You see, to be "middle class", you need to have an income that is actually in the middle percentile of what the country makes.

$300K per year is statistically amongst the wealthiest in the entire nation. Upper, upper class at best.

We can never have a rationale debate on this subject if clowns like you keep insisting that ultra wealthy people are in fact in the middle class.
The problem is that "middle" seems to be a moving target.
 
Originally posted by ucfMike:

Originally posted by UCFRogerz:
I wish I could find daycare for $150/wk.
No doubt. We pay a little over $32k a year here in Chapel Hill for 2 kids, which I believe works out to ~$670.00 per week.
??????????????

When the hell did you pop out a couple kids?!??!?
 
Originally posted by fabknight:



Originally posted by UCFKnight85:


Originally posted by Sir Galahad:
Once again, it depends on what you call middle class. Some people call middle class being able to do things for their kids like sports and dance class, live in a nice house and go on a vacation once a year. I don't see that as something that is asking too much and a family making $75,000 to $100,000 would fit that description. Now that same family making $300,000 a year does not make them rich, it just makes them upper middle class. I have always said, if you need to work to continue your lifestyle, you're not rich.
How many times are you going to say things like this against all facts and studies?

I don't give a shit what you do or don't want to do with your money. I'm only looking at the statistical facts of what income is concentrated where in this country and in what percentile.

You're delusional and ignorant if you think that $300K per year is "upper middle class". A household income of $300K statistically puts someone in the 98th percentile in the US. Which of course means that a whopping 2% of the country makes more than them.

There's nothing middle class about that. You see, to be "middle class", you need to have an income that is actually in the middle percentile of what the country makes.

$300K per year is statistically amongst the wealthiest in the entire nation. Upper, upper class at best.

We can never have a rationale debate on this subject if clowns like you keep insisting that ultra wealthy people are in fact in the middle class.
The problem is that "middle" seems to be a moving target.
It's not moving, we just have some idiots on here. Sir Galahad has flaunted his wealth to us at every opportunity, and now he is claiming he's middle class. Median household income for the US is like 55k, yet 300k is middle class.
 
Originally posted by UCFWayne:
I think this picture is somewhat accurate.
United_States_Class_Structure_Comparison,1984-2014.jpg
This is one classification chart that I'm glad to be just above the line. Those age charts are starting to hate me though...
 
Sir G has repeatedly bragged about being a 1%'er (which is fine, I don't give a shit) but now insists he's a middle class person.

I've definitely never seen someone so eager to make sure that everyone on a message board knows they're wealthy in "real life".
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
chemmie- here is the problem. Most people ARE wreckless and stupid with money, and put themselves in the financial holes that they're in.

Just today in the TBO I read a story about a poor single mother who could barely make ends meat- and then I read that she has 13 kids. 13!! At some point, don't you think this woman should have cut off the baby making
What if that is against her religious beliefs? Maybe she's a devout Catholic that actually practices what she preaches?
 
Originally posted by ucfMike:

Originally posted by UCFRogerz:
I wish I could find daycare for $150/wk.
No doubt. We pay a little over $32k a year here in Chapel Hill for 2 kids, which I believe works out to ~$670.00 per week.
That's insane. I pay $600 a month for afterschool during the school year and the same for summer camp at the great taekwondo studio here in town. They've been fantastic.

Going rate for places here in SE Charlotte is ~$160 a week for places like Tutor Time, Kids are Kids, etc. That must be one swanky place
 
Originally posted by Whataknight:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
chemmie- here is the problem. Most people ARE wreckless and stupid with money, and put themselves in the financial holes that they're in.

Just today in the TBO I read a story about a poor single mother who could barely make ends meat- and then I read that she has 13 kids. 13!! At some point, don't you think this woman should have cut off the baby making
What if that is against her religious beliefs? Maybe she's a devout Catholic that actually practices what she preaches?
If she's practicing what she preaches, Catholic and single mother just doesn't work, unless she's widowed.
 
Originally posted by Whataknight:


Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
chemmie- here is the problem. Most people ARE wreckless and stupid with money, and put themselves in the financial holes that they're in.

Just today in the TBO I read a story about a poor single mother who could barely make ends meat- and then I read that she has 13 kids. 13!! At some point, don't you think this woman should have cut off the baby making
What if that is against her religious beliefs? Maybe she's a devout Catholic that actually practices what she preaches?
Yea, doubt that's the case here.
 
Originally posted by C-MontCityKnight2:
85 is such an idiot. I make $500k per year, but that is definitely middle class. Where does $500k on the scale of $0 and $1,000,000? THE MIDDLE! Idiot.

If you think you could have 4 kids, 4 cars, a lake house, a vacation house, take 4 vacations year, and not live paycheck to paycheck of $500k then you are full of d doo.
Posted from Rivals Mobile
100% correct.

Say you make $300,000 a year, after tax you bring home closer to $185,000 a year, that is $15,000 a month. Now say you have a $4,000 in mortgages, $1,000 a month in car payments, $1,500 a month in utilities and gas, $1,000 a month in entertainment, $3,000 a month in savings(20%), $1,000 a month in food(family of four) and you're quickly down to $3,000 a month in discretionary spending. Now that all may sound like a nice life and it is but I would hardly call that rich. Now once you get around $500,000 a year it starts to compound.

I am not complaining about income but when I think of rich, I think of living where I don't need to work and I can still have the house on the water, the house in the mountains, cars, boats and vacations. It takes 60 hours a week to get those things for my family, that means I'm far from rich, I'm just comfortable.
 
Originally posted by UCFKnight85:
Sir G has repeatedly bragged about being a 1%'er (which is fine, I don't give a shit) but now insists he's a middle class person.

I've definitely never seen someone so eager to make sure that everyone on a message board knows they're wealthy in "real life".
You're a freaking moron. There is a huge difference between making $400,000 than $4,000,000 a year. My day to day life might be better than 99% of Americans in terms of spending but if I stopped working my life would change over night. That means I'm not rich and while you want to put people in categories like middle and upper class its all BS. If you have to work, you're not rich.
 
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