Boy Scouts Officially Allow Girls

[fried-chicken]

Serious question:

Do you not think it’s healthy for boys to have outlets that are just for them, where girls aren’t allowed?

My feelings on this are pretty strong. There needs to be a healthy place for boys to be boys where girls aren’t around. Boys naturally accommodate the presence of girls and change their behavior accordingly when they’re around. From cutting back on things like fart jokes and playing less aggressively, to darker, more negative behaviors like competing for the attention of girls (sometimes in nasty or cruel ways), these are unavoidable consequences of adding girls to a group.

Before you counter with “but they need to learn to interact with girls,” there are countless other situations where they have coed social interaction - school being the most obvious.

To this day, at 35 years old, I still thoroughly enjoy getting together with my guy friends and having some beers. If our significant others are around it’s still a good time, but the energy is different.

Na bro, I think boys should get used to women being included in things and acting in a respectful way towards women even if they can't hear what you're saying.

 

[DaShuckster]

Serious question:

Do you not think it’s healthy for boys to have outlets that are just for them, where girls aren’t allowed?

Serious answer:

Opening up BSA (the program formerly known as Boy Scouts of America) to girls did not make the 12-18 year old scouting program co-ed. Boys still meet and camp by themselves with adult male leaders and so do the girls with adult female leaders. This move was all about giving girls a greater outdoor experience and, of course, increasing its membership.

The BSA leadership felt that the 'separate but equal' approach was necessary because 12-18 year old boys and girls tend to mature at different levels and maintaining the boys-only model allowed boys to assume leadership positions in their troop that they might not otherwise get in a co-ed environment. Of course, in the girls-only troops, the girls are also able to assume leadership positions plus get involved in activities like hunting, fishing, archery, hiking, camping out, etc.

 

[Knight In TN]

Na bro, I think boys should get used to women being included in things and acting in a respectful way towards women even if they can't hear what you're saying.

Do you think the opposite is true?

Should women just get used to guys being included in things?

Are girls nights out also just a disrespectful exclusion where the assumption is bad behavior?

 

[Knight In TN]

Serious answer:

Opening up BSA (the program formerly known as Boy Scouts of America) to girls did not make the 12-18 year old scouting program co-ed. Boys still meet and camp by themselves with adult male leaders and so do the girls with adult female leaders. This move was all about giving girls a greater outdoor experience and, of course, increasing its membership.

The BSA leadership felt that the 'separate but equal' approach was necessary because 12-18 year old boys and girls tend to mature at different levels and maintaining the boys-only model allowed boys to assume leadership positions in their troop that they might not otherwise get in a co-ed environment. Of course, in the girls-only troops, the girls are also able to assume leadership positions plus get involved in activities like hunting, fishing, archery, hiking, camping out, etc.

I have no issues with that at all. It’s a great program, and teaches kids a lot of useful skills and provides a good community building activity for kids who don’t necessarily want to play organized sports.

I’m glad girls get to do the same things if they want to, but it’s good that it sounds like they’re still allowing for a boys/girls only setup.

 

[DaShuckster]

I’m glad girls get to do the same things if they want to, but it’s good that it sounds like they’re still allowing for a boys/girls only setup.

This is why when the controversy first hit, the people who were involved in scouting were like, "what's the big deal here?"

 

[Knight In TN]

My answer to your original question: is it healthy to have a boys-only refuge? "Healthy" is an odd phrasing. It implies you're getting something out of it, which I don't believe is true.
Is it necessary? No.
I don't feel any need to have boys-only time in my life. Never. Maybe I just like my wife a lot.

I say healthy because there’s plenty of literature out there about men and women both sometimes needing to spend time with their guy/girl friends. Take a trip on the google machine sometime and read some of it.

Since my boys-only time is apparently toxic and makes me a meathead, what does a girls’ night make my girlfriend?

Maybe, unlike you, I understand that she really likes some stuff that I don’t really care that much about. I’m open to learning about it, but I’ll never have the same enthusiasm for musical theater she has. I love that she has friends she does get excited about that stuff with.

 

[Knight In TN]

This is why when the controversy first hit, the people who were involved in scouting were like, "what's the big deal here?"

Yeah, they probably could have communicated the changes more effectively.

“We’ll be adding scout troupes for girls as well!” is a lot less controversial than “BSA is now Scouts of America and will be admitting girls.”

 

[DaShuckster]

Yeah, they probably could have communicated the changes more effectively. “We’ll be adding scout troupes for girls as well!” is a lot less controversial than “BSA is now Scouts of America and will be admitting girls.”

The Boy Scouts laid it all out in their press release but, like most things, the media chose to sensationalize it and pit the Boy Scouts against the Girl Scouts.

These are two private organizations who can do whatever the heck they chose to do. But most media reports at the time felt compelled to bring the Girl Scouts into the discussion. The reality is that if the BSA hadn't seen a girls' market that the Girl Scouts weren't serving, the move never would have happened.

I'm admittedly no expert on the Girl Scouts' program but some of the young ladies now in BSA said they were interested in more traditional outdoor activities like hunting, fishing, camping, hiking, and especially archery, than they would've gotten from Girl Scouts.

 

[Crazyhole]

Serious answer:

Opening up BSA (the program formerly known as Boy Scouts of America) to girls did not make the 12-18 year old scouting program co-ed. Boys still meet and camp by themselves with adult male leaders and so do the girls with adult female leaders. This move was all about giving girls a greater outdoor experience and, of course, increasing its membership.

The BSA leadership felt that the 'separate but equal' approach was necessary because 12-18 year old boys and girls tend to mature at different levels and maintaining the boys-only model allowed boys to assume leadership positions in their troop that they might not otherwise get in a co-ed environment. Of course, in the girls-only troops, the girls are also able to assume leadership positions plus get involved in activities like hunting, fishing, archery, hiking, camping out, etc.

Separate but equal you say? Sounds pretty old fashioned.

 

[chemmie]

I say healthy because there’s plenty of literature out there about men and women both sometimes needing to spend time with their guy/girl friends. Take a trip on the google machine sometime and read some of it.

Since my boys-only time is apparently toxic and makes me a meathead, what does a girls’ night make my girlfriend?

Maybe, unlike you, I understand that she really likes some stuff that I don’t really care that much about. I’m open to learning about it, but I’ll never have the same enthusiasm for musical theater she has. I love that she has friends she does get excited about that stuff with.

Having other interests and exploring them separate from the opposite sex isn't the real issue. The issue is feeling that this is necessary. It isn't necessary.
If a female child wants to shoot a gun and go camping instead of knitting, it is totally fine and not hurting anyone.
If a male child wants to bake cookies instead of archery, it is totally fine and not hurting anyone.

The desire to fit comfortably into our gender norms isn't necessary anymore. That is what the BSA was trying to do. Hey, every kid can come camping and fire-building and hunting with us, we don't care if you're a boy or a girl.

This is a good thing for children to learn.

 

[Knight In TN]

Having other interests and exploring them separate from the opposite sex isn't the real issue. The issue is feeling that this is necessary. It isn't necessary.
If a female child wants to shoot a gun and go camping instead of knitting, it is totally fine and not hurting anyone.
If a male child wants to bake cookies instead of archery, it is totally fine and not hurting anyone.

The desire to fit comfortably into our gender norms isn't necessary anymore. That is what the BSA was trying to do. Hey, every kid can come camping and fire-building and hunting with us, we don't care if you're a boy or a girl.

This is a good thing for children to learn.

Yeah, I didn’t think your ignorant ass would answer the question. Instead you just want to build yourself a straw man to attack. If you look back a few posts you’ll see where I already said it’s a good thing girls can pursue the same interests through Scouting.

Go ahead and answer the question about whether or not girls nights are toxic as well.

I think the problem is YOU can’t imagine that someone would be anything other than disrespectful to their partner if they’re away from them and around only other guys. That’s pretty shameful.

 

[chemmie]

Yeah, I didn’t think your ignorant ass would answer the question. Instead you just want to build yourself a straw man to attack. If you look back a few posts you’ll see where I already said it’s a good thing girls can pursue the same interests through Scouting.

Go ahead and answer the question about whether or not girls nights are toxic as well.

I think the problem is YOU can’t imagine that someone would be anything other than disrespectful to their partner if they’re away from them and around only other guys. That’s pretty shameful.

You're asking me a question on a false premise. I never said having a guys night is toxic.

I'm simply saying it isn't necessary. Everyone is free to choose what they want to do. Fortunately, a few years ago the BSA decided to let little girls have the choice to pitch tents, fish, and build campfires. They didn't have that choice then.

 

[Knight In TN]

I never said having a guys night is toxic.

So what you're really saying is that there are things you would do in front of your boys that you wouldn't dare do in the presence of your wife.

You're the one with the problem, meathead.

Backtracking now because you're an intellectually dishonest tool, I see.

I feel bad for you, just like I feel bad for every other person I've ever met without healthy same-sex friendships.

And TIL that girls weren't allowed to build campfires, fish, or pitch tents until the BSA let them a few years ago.

You're astonishingly stupid.

 

[chemmie]

Backtracking now because you're an intellectually dishonest tool, I see.

I feel bad for you, just like I feel bad for every other person I've ever met without healthy same-sex friendships.

And TIL that girls weren't allowed to build campfires, fish, or pitch tents until the BSA let them a few years ago.

You're astonishingly stupid.

I really jumped into the deep end of the bacteria infested gene pool on this one.

You like to bro-down. It's cool, bro. Saturdays are for the boys, bro.

But, none of that bro-ing out is necessary for the development of a healthy young man, or adult man.