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California bans travel to 4 more states (hypocrites)

UCFWayne

UCFWayne

Todd's Tiki Bar
Oct 7, 2011
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/m/b2a5c4...5960327a/ss_california-widens-travel-ban.html

The law bans state-funded or state-sponsored travel by employees of state agencies and departments as well as members of boards, authorities, and commissions.

Travel ban includes:
Kansas
Mississippi
North Carolina
Tennessee
Alabama
Kentucky
South Dakota
Texas

I find it hypocritical that they would have issue with Trumps "muslim" travel ban, but are totally cool with doing that for actual states in the US.
 
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If I were any of those states I would just make it reciprocal. From what I can tell, California needs more tourism than any of the states listed.
 
The Trump and California bans are completely different. Trumps travel ban only affects travel to the US. The California ban is for travel to states and only affects California's state workers. It's not nearly as wide ranging.
 
Great2BAKnight2 said:
The Trump and California bans are completely different. Trumps travel ban only affects travel to the US. The California ban is for travel to states and only affects California's state workers. It's not nearly as wide ranging.
Click to expand...

There are approximately 250,000 employees that work for the State of California, which is a heck of a lot more than "tourists" coming from places like Yemen.

Plus, it will only be a matter of weeks till this spreads to ANYONE (vendors) that does business with the State of California, which would include all local city/county employees (that's another 750,000 more) let alone private/public businesses inside or outside state of California that does business/bids on State jobs.

Yeah, too bad some radicals would allow non vetted "tourists" from Yemen, Syria, etc...but can't deal with American Citizens from scary places like Kansas, Texas, etc...
 
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Great2BAKnight2 said:
The Trump and California bans are completely different. Trumps travel ban only affects travel to the US. The California ban is for travel to states and only affects California's state workers. It's not nearly as wide ranging.
Click to expand...
And it only bans the use of state funds for said travel - it does not restrict travel other than state funds cannot be used to pay for it. It even has certain exemptions for law enforcement and other entities.

What's really dumb about all of this is that while people point to Christianity and cakes for gay weddings, yet if those establishments were truly Christian, there would be no discrimination to anyone. The teachings of Christ talk about loving your neighbors and forgiving your enemies and sinners. Judge not, lest ye be judged yourself and all that.

1 John 2:11
But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
 
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CommuterBob said:
And it only bans the use of state funds for said travel - it does not restrict travel other than state funds cannot be used to pay for it. It even has certain exemptions for law enforcement and other entities.

What's really dumb about all of this is that while people point to Christianity and cakes for gay weddings, yet if those establishments were truly Christian, there would be no discrimination to anyone. The teachings of Christ talk about loving your neighbors and forgiving your enemies and sinners. Judge not, lest ye be judged yourself and all that.

1 John 2:11
But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks in the darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
Click to expand...

This view is incomplete.

There is indeed no room for discriminatory hatred in Christianity, as it teaches that all men and women are created in God's image. You cannot look at a person of another race, gender, or sexual orientation with hatred in your heart because that person was created in God's image and doing so equates to sin against God himself.

However, there is no requirement in Christianity for participating with others in commission of sin. In fact, quite the opposite. 1 Timothy 5:22 says "Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure." The basis of religious freedom says that no one should be forced to perform something that they believe to be sinful. If someone believes that homosexual marriage is a sin, they shouldn't be forced to perform services that enact that marriage and thus sin against God themselves.

Refusing to sin does not equate to hatred. Having a right to refrain from sin does not equate to discrimination.

Government-run agencies should however have to perform gay marriages since that's what's provided for under the law of the land. Additionally, a Christian (or Jew, or Muslim) should be able to work at such agency and their religious beliefs should be reasonably accommodated whereby another worker should perform duties to enact such marriage when called upon.
 
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Knight_Light said:
There are approximately 250,000 employees that work for the State of California, which is a heck of a lot more than "tourists" coming from places like Yemen.

Plus, it will only be a matter of weeks till this spreads to ANYONE (vendors) that does business with the State of California, which would include all local city/county employees (that's another 750,000 more) let alone private/public businesses inside or outside state of California that does business/bids on State jobs.

Yeah, too bad some radicals would allow non vetted "tourists" from Yemen, Syria, etc...but can't deal with American Citizens from scary places like Kansas, Texas, etc...
Click to expand...
I'm talking about wide ranging in scope, not in scale.

Banning specific people from coming here can be a form of discrimination and the Supreme Court will likely take the case and make that determination. Banning your employees from going to specific places is a power the head of any company has, which the State government is in this case. I can't expense a Steak from a strip club because it would jeopardize the values of the company. In the same way, California feels patronizing those states is not congruent with their values. They are within their rights to make that determination and since it does not infringe on the rights of the citizens in those states, it is not discrimination.
 
Great2BAKnight2 said:
I'm talking about wide ranging in scope, not in scale.

Banning specific people from coming here can be a form of discrimination and the Supreme Court will likely take the case and make that determination. Banning your employees from going to specific places is a power the head of any company has, which the State government is in this case. I can't expense a Steak from a strip club because it would jeopardize the values of the company. In the same way, California feels patronizing those states is not congruent with their values. They are within their rights to make that determination and since it does not infringe on the rights of the citizens in those states, it is not discrimination.
Click to expand...
You don't get it:
Trump does it: good
Libs do it: bad, unconstitutional
 
OmniKnight said:
This view is incomplete.

There is indeed no room for discriminatory hatred in Christianity, as it teaches that all men and women are created in God's image. You cannot look at a person of another race, gender, or sexual orientation with hatred in your heart because that person was created in God's image and doing so equates to sin against God himself.

However, there is no requirement in Christianity for participating with others in commission of sin. In fact, quite the opposite. 1 Timothy 5:22 says "Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure." The basis of religious freedom says that no one should be forced to perform something that they believe to be sinful. If someone believes that homosexual marriage is a sin, they shouldn't be forced to perform services that enact that marriage and thus sin against God themselves.

Refusing to sin does not equate to hatred. Having a right to refrain from sin does not equate to discrimination.

Government-run agencies should however have to perform gay marriages since that's what's provided for under the law of the land. Additionally, a Christian (or Jew, or Muslim) should be able to work at such agency and their religious beliefs should be reasonably accommodated whereby another worker should perform duties to enact such marriage when called upon.
Click to expand...
Neither baking a cake nor issuing a civil marriage certificate is committing a sin.
 
Great2BAKnight2 said:
I'm talking about wide ranging in scope, not in scale.

Banning specific people from coming here can be a form of discrimination and the Supreme Court will likely take the case and make that determination. Banning your employees from going to specific places is a power the head of any company has, which the State government is in this case. I can't expense a Steak from a strip club because it would jeopardize the values of the company. In the same way, California feels patronizing those states is not congruent with their values. They are within their rights to make that determination and since it does not infringe on the rights of the citizens in those states, it is not discrimination.
Click to expand...

Supreme Court today has allowed the Travel Pause (90 days) for some (i.e. those without blood relatives in USA nor are doing business in USA) to go in effect today and will rule on the entire issue come Oct.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/26/supreme-court-to-hear-trump-appeal-travel-ban-block.html
 
When has the NRA said they support selling a gun to someone you know is going to use it to commit murder?
 
For now the California travel ban is only for state employees on state business. Can the state guarantee that there will be no repercussions on those state employees who travel on their own time to outlawed States? Can they guarantee there will be no repercussions to those bidding on state business who have office in those states? Fact is California is opening themselves up to a crap load of liability.
 
Still wondering which of the countries in Trump's proposed "muslim ban" would actually be suitable for California workers to visit based on the lgbt standards they set for other states?
 
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CommuterBob said:
Neither baking a cake nor issuing a civil marriage certificate is committing a sin.
Click to expand...

Helping someone sin is no different than indirectly taking part in that sin.
1 Timothy 5:22 Do not participate in the sins of others.
 
CommuterBob said:
You first, I was simply responding in kind to your monosyllabic response.
Click to expand...

Reread and respond to my prior post with a cogent argument based on logic. Here it is:

OmniKnight said:
This view is incomplete.

There is indeed no room for discriminatory hatred in Christianity, as it teaches that all men and women are created in God's image. You cannot look at a person of another race, gender, or sexual orientation with hatred in your heart because that person was created in God's image and doing so equates to sin against God himself.

However, there is no requirement in Christianity for participating with others in commission of sin. In fact, quite the opposite. 1 Timothy 5:22 says "Do not be hasty in the laying on of hands, and do not share in the sins of others. Keep yourself pure." The basis of religious freedom says that no one should be forced to perform something that they believe to be sinful. If someone believes that homosexual marriage is a sin, they shouldn't be forced to perform services that enact that marriage and thus sin against God themselves.

Refusing to sin does not equate to hatred. Having a right to refrain from sin does not equate to discrimination.

Government-run agencies should however have to perform gay marriages since that's what's provided for under the law of the land. Additionally, a Christian (or Jew, or Muslim) should be able to work at such agency and their religious beliefs should be reasonably accommodated whereby another worker should perform duties to enact such marriage when called upon.
Click to expand...
 
OmniKnight said:
That's not an argument based on logic. That's a statement of your (wrong) opinion.
Click to expand...
My opinion is not wrong. Please show where baking a cake is a sin. That is fact that it is not. Being paid to bake a cake for a civil ceremony is not an endorsement of said ceremony. It's getting paid for providing a good/service to your fellow man. Filling out a civil marriage license is not the "individual's" endorsement of the marriage, but rather the civil servant performing his/her job, as mandated by the responsibilities that person agreed to perform when that person was hired. It is nothing more than a formal document for the state.
 
CommuterBob said:
The bible calls homosexuality "detestable" and "immoral" but doesn't specifically call it a sin.
Click to expand...

Wrong. This view is another incomplete perversion of Biblical interpretation.

1 Corinthians 6:18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body.

That alone should sufficiently connect "sexual immorality" and "sin" for you.
 
CommuterBob said:
My opinion is not wrong. Please show where baking a cake is a sin. That is fact that it is not. Being paid to bake a cake for a civil ceremony is not an endorsement of said ceremony. It's getting paid for providing a good/service to your fellow man. Filling out a civil marriage license is not the "individual's" endorsement of the marriage, but rather the civil servant performing his/her job, as mandated by the responsibilities that person agreed to perform when that person was hired. It is nothing more than a formal document for the state.
Click to expand...

That is your opinion.

To the person baking the cake or filling out the marriage license, it absolutely constitutes participation in their fellow man's sin. You don't get to decide their view on faith and their relationship with God for them. Stop making yourself that important - you aren't.
 
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OmniKnight said:
Wrong. This view is another incomplete perversion of Biblical interpretation.

1 Corinthians 6:18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually, sins against their own body.

That alone should sufficiently connect "sexual immorality" and "sin" for you.
Click to expand...
That does not name homosexuality, but only sexual sin, whatever that is. Next.
 
OmniKnight said:
That is your opinion.

To the person baking the cake or filling out the marriage license, it absolutely constitutes participation in their fellow man's sin. You don't get to decide their view on faith and their relationship with God for them. Stop making yourself that important - you aren't.
Click to expand...
And that is YOUR opinion, or rather YOUR judgement of that person. Stop judging, for that truly is a sin.
 
CommuterBob said:
That does not name homosexuality, but only sexual sin, whatever that is. Next.
Click to expand...

Again, trying to point to a lack of "sin" and "homosexuality" in the same sentence is fallacious and intentionally deceitful. A complete understanding of biblical text makes it abundantly clear that homosexuality is against God's will.

CommuterBob said:
And that is YOUR opinion, or rather YOUR judgement of that person. Stop judging, for that truly is a sin.
Click to expand...

Wrong. It is their view on faith and their relationship with God. Not mine. Theirs.
 
OmniKnight said:
Wrong. It is their view on faith and their relationship with God. Not mine. Theirs.
Click to expand...
Many people bastardize religion to suit their personal definitions of their faith. Islamic terrorists are a prime example. Just because they have a skewed vision of what is taught by their religion does not make it what is taught by that religion, or even if it what they are taught, does not make it right.

Homosexuality may or may not be against God's will. God created those people and those people have certain biological responses. It's not their choice in most cases. The Bible is a document written by man and is man's testimony of God and Jesus. And as such, it is not a perfect document. It's been shaped and re-written by man many times - and in some cases has been written to suit political ends. Even if you view their bedroom behavior as a sin, that is their business. It is not for you to judge them as a sinner. The sin of the body is theirs alone. Your "participation" (unless part of an orgy) does not include you if you are simply helping them express their happiness and affirming their love.
 
CommuterBob said:
Homosexuality may or may not be against God's will.
Click to expand...

Wrong. Romans 1:26-28

CommuterBob said:
God created those people and those people have certain biological responses. It's not their choice in most cases.
Click to expand...

Stop trying to define homosexuality scientifically. It hasn't been done.

CommuterBob said:
The Bible is a document written by man and is man's testimony of God and Jesus. And as such, it is not a perfect document. It's been shaped and re-written by man many times - and in some cases has been written to suit political ends. Even if you view their bedroom behavior as a sin, that is their business. It is not for you to judge them as a sinner. The sin of the body is theirs alone.
Click to expand...

No argument on any of this

CommuterBob said:
Your "participation" (unless part of an orgy) does not include you if you are simply helping them express their happiness and affirming their love.
Click to expand...

That is your opinion. You do not get to decide that for people. Their faith and their relationship with God is up to them.

Stop trying to impose your belief system on others.
 
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