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Catching Up to Boise: In-Conference Performance ...

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We've all debated about how UCF has [currently] two (2) NY bowl wins and Boise has three (3) NY bowl wins (and even a couple more top 10 finishes). And we've had the debate about the C-USA v. WAC and, now, AAC v. MWC over the past 6 years.

But one thing I continually bring up is the fact that Boise finds ways to always having winning conference schedules back-to-back-to-back ... going back a couple of decades now. Yes, it's great to have those 'Strength of Brand' (SoB) wins, and UCF is building those like Boise. One could even argue that UCF's wins in the last 5 years have been far more impressive too, but we're still held back by that 2015 "interruption" (and we only beat the bottom of our conference in 2016).

Because contiguous winning seasons, with top results against your conference, shows you're exceeding expectations. That really builds the 'brand name' most in my opinion, because you're getting the top bowls, and beating all sorts of P5 programs. And this was definitely the case for Boise in the first decade this century, as they won the WAC continuously.

Now this has changed a bit in the '10s, as the WAC and MWC merged in 2011. But UCF still has quite a bit to gain in consistency. Although it is interesting to note that Boise has yet to go undefeated in-conference this decade, while UCF has now done it thrice, often with more ranked teams in the AAC than the MWC (including even top 10 teams).

52-20 - UCF Conference Record Since 2010
  • Seasons: 6x Winning - 2x Losing - 1x 0.500
  • Best: 8-0 (2013, 2017, 2018)
  • Median: 7-1
  • Worst: 0-8 (2015)
58-13 - Boise State Conference Record Since 2010
  • Seasons: 9x Winning - 0x Losing
  • Best: 7-1 (2010, *, 2012, 2014, 2017, 2018)
  • Median: 7-1 *
  • Worst: 5-3 (2016)
* 2011 was 6-1 in-conference

Again, this is me, more or less, a major reason why Boise continues to have the "top G5 branding." Just pointing it out, and I hope we can continue to go at least 5-3 in-conference in our worst years. It's definitely become tougher in the AAC, as -- again -- the SB MWC authors also admit. But I hope we can keep it up and finish with 7 winning seasons this decade, now with a trio of 8-0 seasons -- hopefully 3 in a row to close out the decade, although that's a tall order.

BTW, feel free to share this with Boise State fans. They should be welcome on our board. In fact, they might be a nice change from the -- now only more 'butthurt' -- 'Cornholios.' At least they have far, far less G5 ignorance, and some do follow UCF this decade given our more recent successes (and the AAC as well).

ADDED NOTE: I want to give Boise State fans credit for doing more with less. One thing I've noticed on their board, and they are 100% correct, UCF has had the in-state recruiting, money, alumni and TV rating advantages -- all things that should make UCF even way better than Boise. Yet Boise has still been able to accomplish so much, even this decade, let alone last (when UCF wasn't remotely as good).
 
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It’s easier for Boise to have a better record year in and year out. Their conference is way worse. Since the AAC came into existence in 2013 there has only been one other team that finished ranked in the MWC (SDSU at #25 one year). The AAC has had 9 teams finish ranked over the same period.
 
Their weak conference (plus the fact their payout far exceeds their conference mates) makes for easy 10 win seasons and the ability to out-recruit their conference.....they were given a chance to step up, and we know how that turned out.
 
Their weak conference (plus the fact their payout far exceeds their conference mates) makes for easy 10 win seasons and the ability to out-recruit their conference.....they were given a chance to step up, and we know how that turned out.

I don't know how long this ability to out-recruit will last. In their conference, yes, maybe no big difference, but if I'm a kid whose best options are top G5 schools, Boise used to be a no-brainer but now there is competition; i.e. UCF (beautiful Orlando, Disney/theme parks kids love that stuff), and Memphis/Houston (not the best cities in the world but better than living in Idaho). You can say the same thing about BYU but I don't consider BYU anything special. Boise, at least, has their solid brand name.
 
Boise has a better history, but no top tier G5 wants to switch places with Boise. Their brand and prospects were badly damaged when they didn't join the AAC.

If they had joined, they could have created a narrative of a growing program. Dominate the AAC with tougher competition and you show that your program is special and worthy of bigger things.

But now they look like a program that wants to be a big fish in a small pond. They're a cute story, but not a threat to the traditional powers and not a prospect for expansion. More App State than TCU.

"Thanks for entertaining us with the upset. Now go back to your little conference."
 
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I’d like to schedule a. Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, or San Diego State every year.

Replace FAU/FIU with one of those schools and add a third P5 school. I understand that scheduling the bottom level P5 schools will be hard but we might be better off taking a 2-1 deal with legit P5 schools- VT, Auburn (nobody in the SEC would give us that deal, they might even lose at home), OU, Okie State, etc...

If, and I understand it is a big if, but if we could have a schedule that includes Boise, Stanford, Okie State, and Va Tech, plus a somewhat decent AAC schedule, run that table and we could certainly get into the discussion about the College Football Invitational. If we run that gauntlet, we will get more respect than beating FAU, Pitt, and SC State. We might have to have a season or two where we only have 5 home games, but it would be part of the process. We need to show that we can beat more than one decent P5 team a season as we move towards conference TV negotiations, ie conference expansion. Beating the cellar dwellars of the ACC isn't going to get us anywhere. We need to adopt the Bowden philosophy, anybody, anywhere, anytime! Nebraska, you up for a game, or do you prefer FAMU!
 
I don't know how long this ability to out-recruit will last. In their conference, yes, maybe no big difference, but if I'm a kid whose best options are top G5 schools, Boise used to be a no-brainer but now there is competition; i.e. UCF (beautiful Orlando, Disney/theme parks kids love that stuff), and Memphis/Houston (not the best cities in the world but better than living in Idaho). You can say the same thing about BYU but I don't consider BYU anything special. Boise, at least, has their solid brand name.

In all fairness, BYU has a solid brand name. Maybe not as great as they once were, but still a solid program.
 
More like two years imo. 2013 is one year. 2014 we beat no p5 team, 2015 we beat no one and 2016 we beat no p5 team.
That said, on the bright side 3-0 since 2017. Its the best streak we've had against them in program history.
 
Replace FAU/FIU with one of those schools and add a third P5 school. I understand that scheduling the bottom level P5 schools will be hard but we might be better off taking a 2-1 deal with legit P5 schools- VT, Auburn (nobody in the SEC would give us that deal, they might even lose at home), OU, Okie State, etc...

If, and I understand it is a big if, but if we could have a schedule that includes Boise, Stanford, Okie State, and Va Tech, plus a somewhat decent AAC schedule, run that table and we could certainly get into the discussion about the College Football Invitational. If we run that gauntlet, we will get more respect than beating FAU, Pitt, and SC State. We might have to have a season or two where we only have 5 home games, but it would be part of the process. We need to show that we can beat more than one decent P5 team a season as we move towards conference TV negotiations, ie conference expansion. Beating the cellar dwellars of the ACC isn't going to get us anywhere. We need to adopt the Bowden philosophy, anybody, anywhere, anytime! Nebraska, you up for a game, or do you prefer FAMU!
No 2 for 1s. We are getting too far ahead of ourselves. We're in year one of an entire new coaching staff. If we start going anytime anywhere we will make fools of ourselves. And if we only have 5 home games per year our fan base ($$$) will stagnate.

At this time we need to build for a few more years. We need dominating "G5" status before we eventually jump into a "P5" schedule. By this I mean recruiting classes, conference championships, bowl games, and fund raising. Let's take our time while the stakes are low. Of course there will be a time when we have to take the leap and hope it works but right now it's too soon.

If we shit the bed in our first year in a "P5" conference we lose all recruiting momentum and prestige. At that time, the increase in TV money will give us no advantage over anybody else in our conference. We'll struggle to find an elite coach and recruits. And we dont have the number of old/rich alumni (donors) that older programs have. Then we'll be pinned down to the bottom of our conference like so many other "P5" bottom feeders.

Let's just follow DWs plan on this. He's made it clear he is a genius. Trust him.

And give that man another god damn raise!

Sorry for long post

PS: There's three other "P5" programs in our state who all have more money, presrige, recruiting, etc than us. And there's a chance that when we go "P5" so does USF. So there will be 5 "P5" teams sucking up all the oxygen in our state. We're going to get that money but lets make the jump at the best time possible.
 
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I’d like to schedule a. Boise State, Utah State, Fresno State, or San Diego State every year.
Agreed. I would love to see our 4 OOC games annually include 2 P5 teams and the other 2 against any of Boise, Utah State, Fresno, San Diego St., App. State, Troy, Toledo, BYU, or any other of the higher end G5 programs. I know some would say we need some easier games in our schedule, but we get enough of those from usually having a couple of conference opponents with a down year in any given year. This type lineup would increase our SOS, increase fan interest (as compared to some FCS unknowns) and give us the chance to knock off the G5 "competition" at the same time.
 
We were supposed to play Texas in 2017. We had to replace the open date with Maine. Somehow it got moved to 2023 and has now been cancelled. In 2016 USF was supposed to play Mich State and Wisconsin but both of them bailed.

Why don't the pundits call out these kinds of moves....because it helps their narrative and they know 99% of people don't know these "big" programs bail all the time. They won't sign contracts without an "out" to protect their brand.

They would love for us to just play each other so they don't have to play us. Additionally, then we all get extra losses, the pundits will still say we're not playing P5 programs. Remember when Boise State and TCU were great, but decided to play each other to increase their SOS.....it eliminated one of them. Nobody wanted to play them, and you know darn well their were some back channel communications the one year to force them to play each other in a NY6 bowl....so two P5 schools didn't have to lose to them.

I don't think we need to compromise our program to satisfy some talking heads on TV. DW said one of his highest priority is getting at least 6 home games to grow our fanbaseand brand, amongst our own alumni and the Orlando area. I doubt he veers from that.
 
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We were supposed to play Texas in 2017. We had to replace the open date with Maine. Somehow it got moved to 2023 and has now been cancelled. In 2016 USF was supposed to play Mich State and Wisconsin but both of them bailed.

Full disclosure:

Frost asked to move the Texas game. When TX got a chance to schedule AL, they dropped the future game.

2016 was the year the B1G went to 9 conference games so all the teams had to drop an ooc game.
 
Agreed. I would love to see our 4 OOC games annually include 2 P5 teams and the other 2 against any of Boise, Utah State, Fresno, San Diego St., App. State, Troy, Toledo, BYU, or any other of the higher end G5 programs. I know some would say we need some easier games in our schedule, but we get enough of those from usually having a couple of conference opponents with a down year in any given year. This type lineup would increase our SOS, increase fan interest (as compared to some FCS unknowns) and give us the chance to knock off the G5 "competition" at the same time.


Just consider our yearly FCS game is Uconn.

But somehow I seem to doubt the reason we play FCS is for an easy win, scheduling is not that easy and the only group eager for a game (payout) would be an FCS team.
 
Just consider our yearly FCS game is Uconn.

But somehow I seem to doubt the reason we play FCS is for an easy win, scheduling is not that easy and the only group eager for a game (payout) would be an FCS team.
It’s to get a 7th home game since there is no return game with an FCs opponent.
 
Last year I proposed an annual AAC-MWC showdown whereby the teams play each other the third week of November which effectively guarantees an end-of-season ranked opponent for each of the top teams. (Match-ups set based on conference standing after the 4th Saturday of October.) When SEC and ACC teams are playing FCS teams, this year you would have had UCF playing Utah State and Temple v. Boise. In the west you would have Memphis and Houston playing Fresno and SD State. Teams ranked 3-6 in each division would be pitted against each other as well. This could take the place of the FCS game and improve the SOS.

It may mean we have to settle for 6 home games every other year but its a more realistic solution than getting 4 quality P6 opponents in the OOC schedule agreeing to home-and-home every year.
 
Boise has won around 10 games a year for awhile, but they haven't really been a factor nationally since...I don't know. UCF is certainly built better for long term success and more national success due to location, size, and market. Boise started the G5 revolution though, no doubt.
 
Boise has won around 10 games a year for awhile, but they haven't really been a factor nationally since...I don't know. UCF is certainly built better for long term success and more national success due to location, size, and market. Boise started the G5 revolution though, no doubt.
And many Boise State fans will not only admit to this, but they "wear it like a badge." To give them some credit, they certainly have earned it, given the far reduced abilities. At the same time, there is the "distractions" argument of other schools in proximity, etc... whereas they really don't have any "competition" in the nearby area.

But still, I don't care what conference one is in, what they've achieved with no seasons less than 5-3 this decade, and I think that holds through the entire century, is massively impressive. Even Florida, despite all its recruiting and being in the weaker half of the SEC, has lost to FCS teams and crap opponents, with losing seasons.
 
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Last year I proposed an annual AAC-MWC showdown whereby the teams play each other the third week of November which effectively guarantees an end-of-season ranked opponent for each of the top teams. (Match-ups set based on conference standing after the 4th Saturday of October.) When SEC and ACC teams are playing FCS teams, this year you would have had UCF playing Utah State and Temple v. Boise. In the west you would have Memphis and Houston playing Fresno and SD State. Teams ranked 3-6 in each division would be pitted against each other as well. This could take the place of the FCS game and improve the SOS.

It may mean we have to settle for 6 home games every other year but its a more realistic solution than getting 4 quality P6 opponents in the OOC schedule agreeing to home-and-home every year.

If you build the home/away games into the schedule, it is more predictable. For example, UCF would know they have a home game that weekend but just not sure which opponent. I like the idea though.
 
You would know because each year it would alternate between the conference. Even year the AAC hosts, odd years the MWC hosts. Teams could plan other games accordingly.
 
You would know because each year it would alternate between the conference. Even year the AAC hosts, odd years the MWC hosts. Teams could plan other games accordingly.
We could just have 2 games against the MWC per AAC team, every year, one away, one home. That would solve that problem.
 
Replace FAU/FIU with one of those schools and add a third P5 school. I understand that scheduling the bottom level P5 schools will be hard but we might be better off taking a 2-1 deal with legit P5 schools- VT, Auburn (nobody in the SEC would give us that deal, they might even lose at home), OU, Okie State, etc...

If, and I understand it is a big if, but if we could have a schedule that includes Boise, Stanford, Okie State, and Va Tech, plus a somewhat decent AAC schedule, run that table and we could certainly get into the discussion about the College Football Invitational. If we run that gauntlet, we will get more respect than beating FAU, Pitt, and SC State. We might have to have a season or two where we only have 5 home games, but it would be part of the process. We need to show that we can beat more than one decent P5 team a season as we move towards conference TV negotiations, ie conference expansion. Beating the cellar dwellars of the ACC isn't going to get us anywhere. We need to adopt the Bowden philosophy, anybody, anywhere, anytime! Nebraska, you up for a game, or do you prefer FAMU!

No no we do not. This is just the next fake goal post created by the media. Remember last year when the media said if you only went undefeated the year before? Then this year we do I again and they say oh well you didnt play as good of teams as you did last year.

If we beat Bama and Clemson in back to back weeks they would just say that Clemson or Bama is not good this year and we only beat 1 good team.

This 2 for 1 garbage is only becasue UF ducked us in the Peach Bowl.

look at UFs out of confrence schedule outside if FSU it is 2 FCS and Idaho. We already have a tougher OOC schedule than UF. We don't need to give up 3.5million to play UF in a 2 for 1.
 
No no we do not. This is just the next fake goal post created by the media. Remember last year when the media said if you only went undefeated the year before? Then this year we do I again and they say oh well you didnt play as good of teams as you did last year.
^^^ Preach it. Goal posts will always move ...

Until we're in a P5 conference. Just how it is.

If we beat Bama and Clemson in back to back weeks they would just say that Clemson or Bama is not good this year and we only beat 1 good team.

This 2 for 1 garbage is only becasue UF ducked us in the Peach Bowl.

look at UFs out of confrence schedule outside if FSU it is 2 FCS and Idaho. We already have a tougher OOC schedule than UF. We don't need to give up 3.5million to play UF in a 2 for 1.
You could tell Danny White was biting his lip, because his brother is at UF. I totally understand that.

Besides, P5 apologists are going to ignore the obviousness of the truth, including all those at ESPN. They are utterly bad at math, and don't understand the fiscal and scheduling damage and precedents that USF is dealing with. Even Louisville fans were pointing that out, and they still hate us.
 
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Scheduling an upper G5 team does us no good at this point due to P5 snobbery. As a fan of course I would like to see it but we need to continue to look for more P5 games and win them.

What's going against us most in all of this is that TV renegotiation for P5 conferences is still years away. Also, the weak status of the Big 12 makes joining it look about as smart as joining the Big East which imploded. However, when/if the Big 12 expands it should take 4 teams and we don't want to miss out on that. I like the fact that we have a bright future for the QB position now for the next 4 years in the meantime :)
 
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Boise v UCF or some MWC v AAC only helps the P5. Why should we knock each other down?

Let Boise State do their West Coast thing.

We will do our East Coast thing.

Together we will push the conversation towards an expanded CFP playoff that includes G5. We both need to schedule P5 games and put stress on the system.
 
Boise v UCF or some MWC v AAC only helps the P5. Why should we knock each other down?

Let Boise State do their West Coast thing.

We will do our East Coast thing.

Together we will push the conversation towards an expanded CFP playoff that includes G5. We both need to schedule P5 games and put stress on the system.
I agreed. I was just merely pointing to what would have to happen.

In the end, AAC v. MWC scheduling may end up having to happen, if we're all having trouble scheduling P5s, but we want to play better G5s and not opt for FCS teams.
 
Boise is so 2000. Screw them. We’re not trying to be the next Boise. We’re the first UCF.
I think you missed my point. Let me re-quote it, because it's important to understand ...

... Because contiguous winning seasons, with top results against your conference, shows you're exceeding expectations. That really builds the 'brand name' most in my opinion
...
Again, this is me, more or less, a major reason why Boise continues to have the "top G5 branding." Just pointing it out, and I hope we can continue to go at least 5-3 in-conference in our worst years. It's definitely becomes tougher in the AAC, as -- again -- the SB MWC authors also admit ...
 
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Don’t care. We win, I like it. If we make some great Boise argument what’s the point? Is Jesse Palmer gonna be like oh shit, your right! Let me suck on those UCF balls.
 
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The real point probably is, Boise will always be Boise and will always be viewed as better than UCF. Why? Because they aren't the noisy bitch screaming. UCF is. Boise is willing to accept all the old second hand potatoes that the P5's willing to let fall from their table. Go undefeated 5 years straight, and it will always the "Boise brand" because they're willing to bend over and grease up.

The pessimists view.
 
The real point probably is, Boise will always be Boise and will always be viewed as better than UCF. Why? Because they aren't the noisy bitch screaming. UCF is. Boise is willing to accept all the old second hand potatoes that the P5's willing to let fall from their table. Go undefeated 5 years straight, and it will always the "Boise brand" because they're willing to bend over and grease up.

The pessimists view.

So UCF is awesome cause we got a little **** you in us? I’m cool with that. Boise could use a little more **** you.
 
Again, I'm giving Boise props in Conference Performance. But we do need to start addressing the false narrative that UCF doesn't schedule.

That’s pretty telling all around. Definitely Shows that our scheduling isn’t so unlike boise’s and also shows how we have gone from 4 to 3 to 2 P5 a year in the regular season (minus 2013).

Guessing a big part of the latter has been our move from less competitive to more competitive plus opening up our stadium and trying to get more home games.
 
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