Congressional Republicans & the Extension of the Debt Ceiling

[DaShuckster]

Senate votes to extend debt ceiling through early December

The Senate voted 50-48 Thursday evening to extend the nation's debt limit through early December after Democrats and Republicans reached a deal to avert economic disaster following weeks of partisan deadlock over the issue.

www.cnn.com

It appears we have dodge a bullet...at least until December. But of all the stupid stunts and game-playing we've seen in Congress over the years, a GOP-led attempt to force a default on our debt has to be the most lame-brained one we've ever seen!

It's one thing for Republicans to not participate in raising the debt limit and leave it to the majority party. However, it's an entirely different thing to attempt to force a default. What, pray tell, does THAT accomplish? Yeah, Republicans would have really shown those Democrats by...destroying retirement accounts and blowing up our economy? WTF???

You'd think, at some point, Republicans in Congress would grow a f*king brain!

 

[Crazyhole]

50-48 vote with 10 Republicans signing on. What happened to the 10 democrats that didn't vote to approve?

 

[DaShuckster]

From the article:

Ahead of the final vote Thursday evening, the Senate voted to break a filibuster on the agreement to raise the debt ceiling, which needed 60 votes to succeed. The tally was 61-38.

Republican senators provided 11 votes, which when combined with those of members of all the Democratic caucus, got the Senate over the procedural hurdle.

 

[Crazyhole]

From the article:

Ahead of the final vote Thursday evening, the Senate voted to break a filibuster on the agreement to raise the debt ceiling, which needed 60 votes to succeed. The tally was 61-38.

Republican senators provided 11 votes, which when combined with those of members of all the Democratic caucus, got the Senate over the procedural hurdle.

That was to block the filibuster and bring it to the floor for a vote.

The article is kind of confusing. It says 10 Republicans joined in on the vote in one place and then says that 11 Republicans joined in on the procedural vote. What are the 10 votes they were talking about?

 

[UCFKnight85]

Imagine the Democrats controlling every function of govenrment and still claiming it’s the GOPs fault

 

[OLearyLastCall]

Imagine the Democrats controlling every function of govenrment and still claiming it’s the GOPs fault

Debt ceiling can't be raised without Republican support in Senate, but you already knew that.

Also going to save this comment when the shrieks on here happen when Democrats do the only thing they can do in government- pass a reconciliation bill.

 

[Nautiknight]

oh, what the hell. Does any of this matter anymore ? Its all political theater. Republicans Democrats none of it matters. I heard one Democrat Senator say on the $3.5 trillion bill that the federal government can afford what it wants and since child care and preschool are now federal issues , the guy says spend it.

So, now I am proposing Dr. Evil kind of debt ceiling figures. Let's just raise it to a gillion billion dollars and this way we won't default and we can buy what ever we want!

The elites see you and me as nothing more than a tax revenue 9 volt battery .They don't respect the tax payer and they don't respect future generations. This debt ceiling debate is stupid. You know and I know nobody has the courage to say no in DC in terms of spending and it's both sides. I contend if you want these $3.5 trillion bills just raise the debt ceiling to what ever ,just make it unlimited. I am 54 years old not once in my lifetime has the debt actually been paid down. There is zero fiscal discipline in DC.

 

[Crazyhole]

oh, what the hell. Does any of this matter anymore ? Its all political theater. Republicans Democrats none of it matters. I heard one Democrat Senator say on the $3.5 trillion bill that the federal government can afford what it wants and since child care and preschool are now federal issues , the guy says spend it.

So, now I am proposing Dr. Evil kind of debt ceiling figures. Let's just raise it to a gillion billion dollars and this way we won't default and we can buy what ever we want!

The elites see you and me as nothing more than a tax revenue 9 volt battery .They don't respect the tax payer and they don't respect future generations. This debt ceiling debate is stupid. You know and I know nobody has the courage to say no in DC in terms of spending and it's both sides. I contend if you want these $3.5 trillion bills just raise the debt ceiling to what ever ,just make it unlimited. I am 54 years old not once in my lifetime has the debt actually been paid down. There is zero fiscal discipline in DC.

Just mint a bunch of trillion dollar coins. We basically do the same thing with credit.

 

[hemightbejeremy]

oh, what the hell. Does any of this matter anymore ? Its all political theater. Republicans Democrats none of it matters. I heard one Democrat Senator say on the $3.5 trillion bill that the federal government can afford what it wants and since child care and preschool are now federal issues , the guy says spend it.

So, now I am proposing Dr. Evil kind of debt ceiling figures. Let's just raise it to a gillion billion dollars and this way we won't default and we can buy what ever we want!

The elites see you and me as nothing more than a tax revenue 9 volt battery .They don't respect the tax payer and they don't respect future generations. This debt ceiling debate is stupid. You know and I know nobody has the courage to say no in DC in terms of spending and it's both sides. I contend if you want these $3.5 trillion bills just raise the debt ceiling to what ever ,just make it unlimited. I am 54 years old not once in my lifetime has the debt actually been paid down. There is zero fiscal discipline in DC.

The debt was getting paid down in the late 90s. So it is possible. It will require less spending and more tax revenue to accomplish though. And both parties have an appetite for spending.

 

[DaShuckster]

Debt ceiling can't be raised without Republican support in Senate, but you already knew that.

Of course 85 does. It's all game-playing.

Frankly, it takes a lot of gall to whine about 'Democrat spending' when Trump and the Congressional Republicans added over 8 trillion dollars to our national debt over the past four years.

This has zero to do with future spending. Raising the debt ceiling is about not defaulting on our debts by paying our bills on time. The very notion we'd play political games over it is beyond the pale -- particularly from the so-called party of "fiscal conservatism."

 

[UCFKnight85]

Of course 85 does. It's all game-playing.

Frankly, it takes a lot of gall to whine about 'Democrat spending' when Trump and the Congressional Republicans added over 8 trillion dollars to our national debt over the past four years.

This has zero to do with future spending. Raising the debt ceiling is about not defaulting on our debts by paying our bills on time. The very notion we'd play political games over it is beyond the pale -- particularly from the so-called party of "fiscal conservatism."

$8T? So $2T deficits every year? Source?

Or are you just blindly assigning all COVID spending to meanie Republicans?

 

[DaShuckster]

$8T? So $2T deficits every year? Source?

On President Trump's first day in office (January 2017), the total debt load of the nation was $19.95 trillion. In December 2020, the national debt reached a new high of $27.76 trillion. That's an increase of almost 39% in less than four years. (This from a candidate who in 2016 said he would eliminate our national debt in eight years.)

Why the U.S. National Debt Rose to $7.8 Trillion Under Trump

The national debt under former President Trump rose $7.8 trillion amid the tax cuts and spending. It was a crisis even before the COVID-19 pandemic.

marketrealist.com

What You Need to Know About President Trump's Impact on the National Debt

The national debt under President Trump increased by almost 36% to $27 trillion in January 2020.

www.thebalance.com

 

[Crazyhole]

Of course 85 does. It's all game-playing.

Frankly, it takes a lot of gall to whine about 'Democrat spending' when Trump and the Congressional Republicans added over 8 trillion dollars to our national debt over the past four years.

This has zero to do with future spending. Raising the debt ceiling is about not defaulting on our debts by paying our bills on time. The very notion we'd play political games over it is beyond the pale -- particularly from the so-called party of "fiscal conservatism."

Walk me through this rationale. Raising the debt limit has nothing to do with the money that we are going to spend, it's about money that we already spent. Do I have that correct?

 

[Crazyhole]

On President Trump's first day in office (January 2017), the total debt load of the nation was $19.95 trillion. In December 2020, the national debt reached a new high of $27.76 trillion. That's an increase of almost 39% in less than four years. (This from a candidate who in 2016 said he would eliminate our national debt in eight years.)

Why the U.S. National Debt Rose to $7.8 Trillion Under Trump

The national debt under former President Trump rose $7.8 trillion amid the tax cuts and spending. It was a crisis even before the COVID-19 pandemic.

marketrealist.com

What You Need to Know About President Trump's Impact on the National Debt

The national debt under President Trump increased by almost 36% to $27 trillion in January 2020.

www.thebalance.com

Trump was just paying off old debt. That was all Obama spending.

 

[Nautiknight]

The debt was getting paid down in the late 90s. So it is possible. It will require less spending and more tax revenue to accomplish though. And both parties have an appetite for spending.

I graduated UCF in 92. I wasn't into politics much. In 94 I graduated from FSU and I was little more interested. I know Gingrich contract with America coupled with Clinton willing to work with Newt led to a balanced budget of sorts where spending was matched to revenue. I do not recall the debt actually being reduced just not added too. doesn't mean it didn't happen.

Now spending is just stupid crazy and they ,Congress doesn't care and they fall back on hey we will just tax more and especially play the rich card. The rich don't have enough wealth to pay for it all. They are going to come after the middle class more and more. You guys can play your side and as I see it it's 436 elitist against 330 million Americans. I can't stand DC and they collectively are the problem not the solution.

 

[Nautiknight]

Of course 85 does. It's all game-playing.

Frankly, it takes a lot of gall to whine about 'Democrat spending' when Trump and the Congressional Republicans added over 8 trillion dollars to our national debt over the past four years.

This has zero to do with future spending. Raising the debt ceiling is about not defaulting on our debts by paying our bills on time. The very notion we'd play political games over it is beyond the pale -- particularly from the so-called party of "fiscal conservatism."

Getting your credit card limit increased to $20,000 from $10,000 doesn't help you pay your bills.

 

[Nautiknight]

Hey Shuck,
My son was born in 2001. The debt was $1 trillion dollars. From 1891 when the Constitution was ratified until my son's birth the federal government racked up $1 trillion in debt. In his lifetime it has increased to $27 trillion. that's 27 fold increased in debt due to spending.

Now you can blame Republicans,because I do and I blame Democrats. They are all to blame. I don't blame Presidents because all taxation and spending originates in the House . The House with both parties are derillict in their duty to manage the fiscal affairs of the federal government. Its both sides and both sides can tell the executive branch no.

But, if you want to blame Bush and Trump and that makes you feel good. I say that's cool. Or, you can put your big boy pants on and see it's my side ,your side, and what ever side that is driving our fiscal car over the cliff. We can't spend our way out and we can't tax our way out of it. If spending leads to prosperity then places like the former Soviet Union, Venezuela, Cuba and North Korea would lead the world in economic prosperity and government solvency
.

 

[UCFKnight85]

On President Trump's first day in office (January 2017), the total debt load of the nation was $19.95 trillion. In December 2020, the national debt reached a new high of $27.76 trillion. That's an increase of almost 39% in less than four years. (This from a candidate who in 2016 said he would eliminate our national debt in eight years.)

Why the U.S. National Debt Rose to $7.8 Trillion Under Trump

The national debt under former President Trump rose $7.8 trillion amid the tax cuts and spending. It was a crisis even before the COVID-19 pandemic.

marketrealist.com

What You Need to Know About President Trump's Impact on the National Debt

The national debt under President Trump increased by almost 36% to $27 trillion in January 2020.

www.thebalance.com

That’s an asinine way to cherry pick what you want to hear. The first GOP/Trump budget didn’t even pass Congress until late in 2017 and then was signed. The Democrats then won the House in the 2018 election and owned the budget as of Jan 2019. Therefore “Trump and congressional Republicans” only had budget cycle authority for a whopping 2 years.

The net rise in the years that the GOP was passing budgets was about $2.5T. Not great but also not the $8T you’re trying to assert.

Fiscal Data Explains the National Debt

Check out @FiscalService Fiscal Data’s new national debt page! #NationalDebt

datalab.usaspending.gov

Since controlling the House and then subsequently all of Government, the Democrats have added roughly $6T in debt during budget cycles that they control

 

[Cubs79]

Trump was just paying off old debt. That was all Obama spending.

And Obama was paying off Bush debt, etc etc. Debt obviously doesnt go away when we have a new president and congress, so you can make that statement about every administration.

 

[Cubs79]

The debt was getting paid down in the late 90s. So it is possible. It will require less spending and more tax revenue to accomplish though. And both parties have an appetite for spending.

It can also be paid down if spent properly, meaning mainly spent in this country. Much of the debt this century has been due to long wars which dont really benefit the American people as a whole. Infrastructure is something that does directly affect Americans both jobs and increased commerce, and lot of it will be returned to the government when it is taxed.

 

[Cubs79]

Imagine the Democrats controlling every function of govenrment and still claiming it’s the GOPs fault

THe debt doesnt reset when a new party controls the government.

 

[Crazyhole]

And Obama was paying off Bush debt, etc etc. Debt obviously doesnt go away when we have a new president and congress, so you can make that statement about every administration.

See how ridiculous that is? We aren't creating new debt by borrowing another 500 billion, that just goes to replace the old debt. You'd have to be a moron to believe that line of crap but they're pushing it anyway.

 

[DaShuckster]

Imagine the Democrats controlling every function of government and still claiming it’s the GOPs fault

The debt doesn't reset when a new party controls the government.

Of course it doesn't. The U.S. government has never provided a full accounting of the costs of America’s so-called “forever wars” in Afghanistan and Iraq. But researchers at Brown University estimate that the U.S. has spent $5.8 trillion on the war in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Did we tighten our belts to pay for these conflicts? OF COURSE NOT! The Bush Administration borrowed money from China.

But keep claiming our national debt is all the Democrats' fault.

 

[DaShuckster]

The net rise in the years that the GOP was passing budgets was about $2.5T. Not great but also not the $8T you’re trying to assert.

I've never been great at math but the increase in our national debt during the Trump years was a hell of a lot more than $2.5 trillion.

Trump said on the campaign trail back in 2016 that he'd wipe out our national debt in eight years as President. I woulda thought that he'd have halved it in four.

 

[UCFKnight85]

I've never been great at math but the increase in our national debt during the Trump years was a hell of a lot more than $2.5 trillion.

Trump said on the campaign trail back in 2016 that he'd wipe out our national debt in eight years as President. I woulda thought that he'd have halved it in four.

Jesus Christ just read what I wrote. Hint: Congress controls the budget.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Of course it doesn't. The U.S. government has never provided a full accounting of the costs of America’s so-called “forever wars” in Afghanistan and Iraq. But researchers at Brown University estimate that the U.S. has spent $5.8 trillion on the war in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Did we tighten our belts to pay for these conflicts? OF COURSE NOT! The Bush Administration borrowed money from China.

But keep claiming our national debt is all the Democrats' fault.

Actually the war cost was allocated for every single year in what was called the Overseas Contingency Operatiosn fund or OCO. It was a submitted budget sent to Congress every year and passed by Congress every year. To include when the Democrats won control of Congress in 2006 and then continued throughout Obamas entire term, to include when the Democrats had super majorities in both chambers on Congress.

But facts, and stuff.

 

[DaShuckster]

But facts, and stuff.

Yep. Facts like Congress (Republicans & Democrats) and our Presidents (Republican & Democrats) playing a role in our ballooning national debt?

This thread is all about Mitch McConnell's assertion that raising the debt ceiling is "all on the Democrats to do." Yeah, riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Republicans are SO innocent when it comes to spending.

 

[KnoxvilleKnight]

Debt ceiling can't be raised without Republican support in Senate, but you already knew that.

Also going to save this comment when the shrieks on here happen when Democrats do the only thing they can do in government- pass a reconciliation bill.

So why didn’t they pass a reconciliation bill to raise the debt limit?

Neither side gives a f about our debt or spending and they have no reason to as long as they can print all the money they need.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Yep. Facts like Congress (Republicans & Democrats) and our Presidents (Republican & Democrats) playing a role in our ballooning national debt?

This thread is all about Mitch McConnell's assertion that raising the debt ceiling is "all on the Democrats to do." Yeah, riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Republicans are SO innocent when it comes to spending.

Thats not what McConnell is saying. What he’s saying is that if the Democrats are intent to govern entirely along 50 vote partisan lines, which they are fully intent on doing, then they can tackle this one in that manner too. I don’t even agree with the tactic but I understand the point.

As a reminder, there’s a bipartisan infrastructure bill sitting in the House that already passed the Senate, and it’s effectively been taken hostage and nearly killed thanks to the Democrats who want to govern entirely on 50 vote partisan lines to pass a different piece of legislation before tending to bipartisan matters.

Get it?

 

[DaShuckster]

Thats not what McConnell is saying. What he’s saying is that if the Democrats are intent to govern entirely along 50 vote partisan lines, which they are fully intent on doing, then they can tackle this one in that manner too. I don’t even agree with the tactic but I understand the point.

If this was a straight partisan vote, why did the Senate have to vote to break a filibuster on an agreement to raise the debt ceiling? Killing the filibuster required 60 votes to pass. What's THAT tactic all about?

Instead of just allowing the Dems to pass a debt ceiling measure on their own, this sure seemed like a lamebrained attempt by the Republicans to push a default on our debt.

Fortunately, just enough clear-thinking Republicans voted with the Democrats to kill it, 61-38.

 

[Crazyhole]

Tax revenues went up every year under Trump. Funny how that part goes unnoticed when talking about "tax cuts" and the debt.

 

[goodknightfl]

We should have extended the debt ceiling forever, limited spending to current #s adjusted for inflation beginning year 3. All salary and benefits to Elected Federal officials should be from now on calculated the same way we do Social Security and Medicare.

 

[goodknightfl]

Of course it doesn't. The U.S. government has never provided a full accounting of the costs of America’s so-called “forever wars” in Afghanistan and Iraq. But researchers at Brown University estimate that the U.S. has spent $5.8 trillion on the war in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Did we tighten our belts to pay for these conflicts? OF COURSE NOT! The Bush Administration borrowed money from China.

But keep claiming our national debt is all the Democrats' fault.

5.8 Trillion over 20 years is a different animal than 2 to 3 trillion in the last 9 mos plus the 5 trillion they wish to add on top of that in the next few months. Every administration is borrowing for China, that is where the available $$ was. US Government borrows it, then gives it back as aide. It is the American way.

 

[DaShuckster]

5.8 Trillion over 20 years is a different animal than 2 to 3 trillion in the last 9 mos

True. The support given out earlier this year actually HELPED some people. What, pray tell, did we get for the 5.8 over 20 years?