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DeSantis and Higher Education in FL

Poolside Knight

Todd's Tiki Bar
Apr 2, 2007
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It is one thing to be worried about something said in 3rd grade but at the college level this is ridiculous and dangerous. UCF professors changing names of courses to avoid getting hassled by our Governor’s administration. And if UCF tells them to F off we probably end up with Randy Fine as our University President the way things are going

 
It is one thing to be worried about something said in 3rd grade but at the college level this is ridiculous and dangerous. UCF professors changing names of courses to avoid getting hassled by our Governor’s administration. And if UCF tells them to F off we probably end up with Randy Fine as our University President the way things are going

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‘Dismay and anxiety’ on college campuses as DeSantis ramps up anti-CRT campaign​

Jan 13, 2023 at 3:40 pm
Incoming students walk to the University of Central Florida football stadium as UCF welcomed them to campus before the beginning of the new school year, Sunday, Aug. 21, 2022, in Orlando, Fla.

Incoming students walk to the University of Central Florida football stadium as UCF welcomed them to campus before the beginning of the new school year, Sunday, Aug. 21, 2022, in Orlando, Fla. (Phelan M. Ebenhack / Orlando Sentinel)


Yovanna Pineda, hired more than a decade ago to teach Latin American history at the University of Central Florida, rebranded one of her signature courses last fall.

Striking references to “dictatorships” and “human rights” from the title, she decided to simply call her class “History of South America.”

Pineda said many of her colleagues are making similar changes, either because they fear blowback from state leaders who say they are trying to eliminate “indoctrination” from university campuses or because they don’t want the hassle of additional scrutiny.

“Some of us are becoming a little more cautious about how we say things and much more aware of how we title our courses,” Pineda said.

Even as the implementation of a new law that Gov. Ron DeSantis said is intended to combat the “far-left woke agenda” stalls in court, university faculty members like Pineda have renamed their courses or shied away from hot-button topics like race and sexuality.

DeSantis signed the law, dubbed “Stop WOKE,” last summer banning the teaching of a once-esoteric academic concept called critical race theory in state universities, colleges, and K-12 schools. A federal court has temporarily blockedthe law, which prohibits teaching students that people are “privileged or oppressed” based on their race, color, nationality or sex, with a judge describing it as a “positively dystopian” violation of professors’ First Amendment rights.

But DeSantis continued his campaign last week, appointing far-right activist Christopher Rufo to the Board of Trustees at New College of Florida. Rufo is best known for launching a national campaign against critical race theory, making the once-obscure subject into a lightning rod that has prompted protests at school boards across the country.

Ron DeSantis signed HB 7, known as the Stop WOKE” bill, in Hialeah Gardens, Florida, on April 22, 2022. To his right is Christopher Rufo, a far-right activist who helped launch a nationwide furor against critical race theory and who DeSantis recently appointed to the Board of Trustees at New College of Florida.

Ron DeSantis signed HB 7, known as the "Stop WOKE” bill, in Hialeah Gardens, Florida, on April 22, 2022. To his right is Christopher Rufo, a far-right activist who helped launch a nationwide furor against critical race theory and who DeSantis recently appointed to the Board of Trustees at New College of Florida. (Daniel A. Varela/Miami Herald/TNS)


DeSantis hopes the new trustees will help correct a “skewed focus and impractical course offerings” at New College that have resulted in low student enrollment and financial problems, according to a statement Bryan Griffin, a spokesperson for the governor, provided to the News Service of Florida.

Rufo told The New York Times he and his new colleagues seek to transform New College into a public version of Michigan’s Hillsdale College, a conservative Christian school.

“We want to provide an alternative for conservative families in the state of Florida to say there is a public university that reflects your values,” he said.

The appointment of Rufo and the others to New College’s board prompted protests at Sarasota County’s legislative delegation meeting on Thursday. A petition against the appointments had gathered more than 1,500 signatures by Friday afternoon. New College students “feel they are being used as a pawn in the governor’s game,” the petition said, and urge the Legislature to vote against confirming the appointments.

“The governor frequently espouses a belief that parents and students should have control over pursuing an education of their own choosing,” the petition said. “For this reason, many of us associated with this school have been struck by the flippancy with which he would deny students at New College that right by pushing to remake the school in his own image, against the will of students, parents, and faculty.”

And on Thursday, Florida House Speaker Paul Renner, R-Palm Coast, sent letters to presidents of the 12 state institutions, requesting records including lists of all diversity, equity and inclusion employees; a description of their responsibilities; and their salaries.


The purpose, he wrote, was to ensure students are receiving an education without “promoting an aggressively ideological agenda under the guise of diversity, equity and inclusion,” and to assess the “costs and benefits” of these initiatives.

Renner’s request follows one from DeSantis’ office last week, which sought a “comprehensive list of all staff, programs and campus activities” related to critical race theory and diversity, equity and inclusion at colleges and universities. Faculty unions decried the inquiry, saying they feared it could chill free speech on their campuses.

And faculty members say they’ve seen other signs that the governor has gained a foothold on their campuses, including the removal of the words “social justice” from the name of an office at UCF, which has been rebranded as the Office of Civil Discourse. The words “equity” and “equal” were also stripped from the office’s webpage.

A spokesperson for the university said the name change was prompted by the office’s move to the new Ginsburg Center for Inclusion and Community Engagement, which promotes diversity and inclusion initiatives.


Incoming students visit various campus groups and clubs at the University of Central Florida football stadium as UCF welcomed them to campus before the beginning of the new school year, Sunday, Aug. 21, 2022, in Orlando, Fla.

Incoming students visit various campus groups and clubs at the University of Central Florida football stadium as UCF welcomed them to campus before the beginning of the new school year, Sunday, Aug. 21, 2022, in Orlando, Fla. (Phelan M. Ebenhack / Orlando Sentinel)

Existing UCF offices and staff with areas of emphasis related to cross-cultural competencies, civil discourse and civic engagement became part of the center,” Gilmartin wrote. “As part of this ongoing transition, names and efforts are being updated to align with the Center’s mission and UCF’s commitment to inclusive excellence.”

She did not respond to questions about whether changing the name of the office and the language on the website was prompted by the “Stop WOKE” law or direction from the governor’s office or the state university system.

But some faculty members and students suspect political pressure spurred the name change, said Martha Brenckle, a professor in the College of Arts and Humanities at UCF. There’s a feeling of “distrust and uneasiness” across the campus, she said.

“I just feel like that free thinking is being attacked, questioning your governor is being attacked,” she said.

Some faculty members have gone so far as to change the content of their courses, including a sociology professor who told ProPublica he’d scrapped two courses on race-related issues a month before the fall semester was to start. The faculty member, who did not yet have tenure, said he feared losing his job.


Though DeSantis has directed much of his scrutiny at the state universities, some state college faculty say they feel like they’re under attack, too. Chris Borglum, an English instructor at Valencia College’s Winter Park campus, described a feeling of “dismay and anxiety” among his colleagues.

The point of higher education, he said, is to teach students to evaluate sources of information, think about important concepts and form their own opinions.

“There’s no need for any governmental institutions to interfere with that process,” said Borglum, who has taught at Valencia for 30 years.

DeSantis and his allies have beat the drum about the importance of free speech, Borglum said. Two years ago, they backed a separate law that required universities to survey employees and students about whether they felt their campuses promoted the free exchange of ideas. Few people filled out the surveys across the state, but a majority of those who did agreed that liberal and conservative ideas and beliefs were equally tolerated on campus.

The latest push to rid universities of critical race theory, he said, shows the governor and other conservatives “think their ideas are not winning in the marketplace of ideas so they need to rig the game.”

“I will change nothing, he said, adding “I have argued that those of us with tenure have a responsibility to not change what we do.”

Jack Chambless, who teaches economics at Valencia’s west campus in MetroWest, said he’s never heard of a student complaining another instructor tried to indoctrinate them in class.

“We’re doing our jobs in a professional way and we’re not crossing any lines that the public should be concerned about,” Chambless said.

Chambless, who is in his 32nd year at Valencia, said college administrators have never tried to discourage him from publicly expressing his Libertarian views. In November, he gave a talk called “Did Racism create Capitalism?” critiquing Ibram X. Kendi’s “How to be an Antiracist.” The speech, which was open to the public, was well-attended by students who asked thoughtful questions.

But he said he’s heard stories of students elsewhere shouting down conservative speakers or trying to prevent them from sharing their views. There’s “a growing pressure in higher education to not be an environment where all voices should be heard,” he said, and Florida leaders may be responding to that tension.

“What may be happening in Florida may be a reaction to what is happening elsewhere,” he said.

anmartin@orlandosentinel.com
 
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It is one thing to be worried about something said in 3rd grade but at the college level this is ridiculous and dangerous. UCF professors changing names of courses to avoid getting hassled by our Governor’s administration. And if UCF tells them to F off we probably end up with Randy Fine as our University President the way things are going

Desantis is just in this for the power and money, and if he runs for president he is going to get exposed for the useless empty suit he is. While florida is becoming more and more unaffordable, a major insurance situation which is just going to get worse, etc etc, and this dude is just twiddling his thumbs going after "woke" so fox news will like him.
 
Nothing says "small government" than the government telling schools what they can't teach.
Yeah, CRT is just a clever way to scare schools into not talking about race. And the "Don't talk Gay" business is meant to make sure that elementary school teachers with children of gay parents in their classes keep quiet about 'any of that gay stuff.'
Everyday the GOP proves itself to be more and more of an anti freedom joke.
Exactly. These same "small government" advocates want to the government to force women to carry 15 week embryos to term. But on the other hand, don't you DARE tell me I should get the covid vaccine for me and my loved ones!!!!
 
every Public University is dealing with this but it seems like the State Government is obsessed w picking on UCF.

 

I was down in Florida last week, and a few examples of people just feeling comfortable openly stating their racism to complete strangers, and my first thought, was this is what Trump and people like Desantis are doing. And it is this type of shit that causes that. I certainly have some issues with "woke" by all means, but to a certain crowd it pretty obvious than anti-woke just means its ok to be racist.
 
I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.
Yeah, eliminating all studies about people of color is an excellent way of getting there, right? :rolleyes:


Funny how the people complaining about the evils of "government control" tend to be the same ones dictating to educators what high school and college courses are "education worthy" and which ones are not.
 
Yeah, eliminating all studies about people of color is an excellent way of getting there, right? :rolleyes:


Funny how the people complaining about the evils of "government control" tend to be the same ones dictating to educators what high school and college courses are "education worthy" and which ones are not.
"My body my choice", shoe on the other foot counter point.

I agree with OP, if you want to pay for cultural course work, have at it... however I don't believe it belongs in required K-12 curriculum

Personal experience - My 3rd grader comes home from school one day, puzzled, then asks me why does skin color matter? ...I was proud initially, and reaffirmed it absolutely doesn't matter, but rather a person's attitude and effort.

Simultaneously, I was saddened and a bit upset seeing his innocence being wrongfully stripped from him, by adults entrusted to educate our youth on subjects required for a successful life.

That didn't happen at home, didn't happen in athletics, but at school which should be the safest place outside of the house.
 
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"My body my choice", shoe on the other foot counter point.
Funny how the people complaining about "governmental control" during the pandemic with shouts of "my body, my choice" regarding the COVID vaccines and---gasp!---being REQUIRED to wear masks in public places tend to be the same ones cool with taking away the right to an abortion from women in this country. Weird how that works.
I agree with OP, if you want to pay for cultural course work, have at it... however I don't believe it belongs in required K-12 curriculum
Is US history part of your K-12 curriculum? Let me guess, it's perfectly fine as long as skin color doesn't come into it. It should all be about a person's attitude and effort, right? :rolleyes:
Simultaneously, I was saddened and a bit upset seeing his innocence being wrongfully stripped from him, by adults entrusted to educate our youth on subjects required for a successful life.
...stripped of his innocence??!? Good grief. SMH.

News flash: Your son will grow to adulthood in an increasingly multicultural society. You'd THINK you'd have enough common sense to want him educated on areas that will help him live a successful life.
 
I look to a day when people will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.
History is history, and black history is a large part of American history. Anyone who says what you say, but then wants to whitewash our history, is most certainly not judging people by the content of their character. It is an intentional attempt to overlook the character of many people throughout out history, you know the slave owners, segregationists, etc. How do you judge their characters?
 
Personal experience - My 3rd grader comes home from school one day, puzzled, then asks me why does skin color matter? ...I was proud initially, and reaffirmed it absolutely doesn't matter, but rather a person's attitude and effort.

Simultaneously, I was saddened and a bit upset seeing his innocence being wrongfully stripped from him, by adults entrusted to educate our youth on subjects required for a successful life.
Did you ever stop to consider the innocence of a 3rd grade minority student when she is told by people like you that her experiences don't matter because we're all "color-blind" now? Or the innocence of a 3rd grader who is told that talking about his parents in school is a 'no-no' because they're gay?

God forbid our kids learn that human experiences have differed dramatically over the centuries based on one's gender, skin color and/or status with society. Instead of pretending our world is free of racism, homophobia, and misogyny, we can view history from different perspectives and, as a result, perhaps learn to better appreciate one another.
 
Did you ever stop to consider the innocence of a 3rd grade minority student when she is told by people like you that her experiences don't matter because we're all "color-blind" now? Or the innocence of a 3rd grader who is told that talking about his parents in school is a 'no-no' because they're gay?

God forbid our kids learn that human experiences have differed dramatically over the centuries based on one's gender, skin color and/or status with society. Instead of pretending our world is free of racism, homophobia, and misogyny, we can view history from different perspectives and, as a result, perhaps learn to better appreciate one another.
History is history, and black history is a large part of American history. Anyone who says what you say, but then wants to whitewash our history, is most certainly not judging people by the content of their character. It is an intentional attempt to overlook the character of many people throughout out history, you know the slave owners, segregationists, etc. How do you judge their characters?
You lose people the moment you attempt to put words in their mouths to push your narrative, for reasons only you know.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that.

Be the light by example, not just empty words. That's the true sign of care. Most churches offer programs to help under privileged children see the light, I know this from routine first-hand experience. Hope to see you out there sometime, you'll be enlightened.
 
You lose people the moment you attempt to put words in their mouths to push your narrative, for reasons only you know.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that.

Be the light by example, not just empty words. That's the true sign of care. Most churches offer programs to help under privileged children see the light, I know this from routine first-hand experience. Hope to see you out there sometime, you'll be enlightened.

You are talking about "dark and light" and then accusing other people of using empty words? That is rich to say the least.

How are we supposed to judge people, or in this case historical figures and events, by their character, if we dont teach such things? White washing history isnt judging people by their character, it is trying to hide their character and then judging them by some cartoonish view of history.
 
You lose people the moment you attempt to put words in their mouths to push your narrative, for reasons only you know.
Point out where that happened here? Tell me, who uttered this gem? You? or did I somehow put words in your mouth?
Personal experience - My 3rd grader comes home from school one day, puzzled, then asks me why does skin color matter? ...I was proud initially, and reaffirmed it absolutely doesn't matter, but rather a person's attitude and effort. Simultaneously, I was saddened and a bit upset seeing his innocence being wrongfully stripped from him, by adults entrusted to educate our youth on subjects required for a successful life.
You're the one taking about having your 3rd grade son's "innocence wrongly stripped from him."
 
"...did I somehow put words in your mouth?"

"...when she is told by people like you that her experiences don't matter... "


How are we supposed to judge people,

"...Anyone who says what you say, but then wants to whitewash our history..."


These are both your assertive and presumptive words, towards someone you don't personally know. Broad brush villainizing categorization, a tactic used too often.

I truly believe you guys mean well, but it's this polarizing rhetoric which renders your efforts ineffective with folks in the middle. It's good for a few thumbs up reactions from like-minded individuals, but set the goal higher.

This was my drive by take for the day/week... Count your blessings, and go out and do good this weekend. Make it better than you found it with "actions", not message board posts.

Talk soon my UCFriends

🎤
 
"...when she is told by people like you that her experiences don't matter..."...Anyone who says what you say, but then wants to whitewash our history..."
These are both your assertive and presumptive words, towards someone you don't personally know. Broad brush villainizing categorization, a tactic used too often.
You don't get to play it both ways on a message board. If we're taking your comments differently than you intended, it's on YOU to explain what you really meant.

All any of us can react to are the words we post because we don't know each other personally. If we're unfairly 'villainizing' you, help us out and explain yourself.
This was my drive by take for the day/week... Count your blessings and go out and do good this weekend. Make it better than you found it with "actions", not message board posts.
Awww, that's SO sweet. Geez, I guess we all took your drive-by comments the wrong way, huh? I'm guessing this means you don't have to explain yourself after all.
 
"...when she is told by people like you that her experiences don't matter... "




"...Anyone who says what you say, but then wants to whitewash our history..."


These are both your assertive and presumptive words, towards someone you don't personally know. Broad brush villainizing categorization, a tactic used too often.

I truly believe you guys mean well, but it's this polarizing rhetoric which renders your efforts ineffective with folks in the middle. It's good for a few thumbs up reactions from like-minded individuals, but set the goal higher.

This was my drive by take for the day/week... Count your blessings, and go out and do good this weekend. Make it better than you found it with "actions", not message board posts.

Talk soon my UCFriends

🎤
Having a conversation isn't polarizing rhetoric. Instead of coming here to lecture everyone, why not posts your views of things so we can actually have a discussion. And BTW, democrats have done pretty well with folks in the middle overall, the last couple of elections, so maybe it is the rhetoric from the right that is ineffective with folks in the middle.
 
So lawmakers in Florida are concerned about "identity politics" in higher education?

If a Black museum is considered "identity politics," I would like a Florida lawmaker to explain to me what's the difference between it and any so-called 'regular' museum?

Inquiring minds want to know.
What does Black mean? (Or any color for that matter)

-Skin color categorization?
-Ethnic/Cultural heritage?
-Country/regional lineage?

No hate - curious of everyone's take.
 
What does Black mean? (Or any color for that matter)

No hate - curious of everyone's take.
Our country is composed of a wide-variety of people with different skin colors, ethnicities, cultures, languages, religions, sexual orientations, hey, you name it.

Do you think all these people have seen themselves recognized and respected within our society? Have the experiences of minorities and their viewpoints been respectfully addressed in our collective history?

If our goal is to enhance our world, it seems to me we should all be mindful and respectful of our diversity instead of fearing our children's "innocence" will somehow be 'wrongfully lost' because of it.

But we're all humans and our nature is to fear what we don't know and understand (thus, we get questions like "What does Black mean?) When push comes to shove, we want to stick closely to our 'clans.' Its been that way throughout human history. We continue to make some progress, but its slow.
 
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Our country is composed of a wide-variety of people with different skin colors, ethnicities, cultures, languages, religions, sexual orientations, hey, you name it.

Do you think all these people have seen themselves recognized and respected within our society? Have the experiences of minorities and their viewpoints been repectfully addressed in our collective history?

If our goal is to enhance our world, it seems to me we should all be mindful and respectful of our diversity instead of fearing our children's "innocence" will somehow be 'wrongfully lost' because of it.

But we're all humans and our nature is to fear what we don't know and understand (thus, we get questions like "What does Black mean?) When push comes to shove, we want to stick closely to our 'clans.' Its been that way throughout human history. We continue to make some progress, but its slow.
Lots of words, no answer to the question.
 
Jesus Christ, this feels like its straight out of some dystopian sci-fi novel, not from the evening news.

I am starting to think Desantis simply isnt very bright. Why in the world would someone who wants to be president think that this type of stuff is going to fly around the country. Most people try to pivot towards the center to appeal to moderates, this dude's whole agenda is to appeal to right wing nut jobs. Does he not realize many Republicans who just ran for office with this type of craziness, lost their elections?
 
Scary if true / used for malice use...

Most employers will reserve the right to "monitor" company assets/email. Always assume someone is watching.

And at some point professors are just going to leave the state of FLorida so they can actually teach, and not have to worry about an over reaching far right governor breathing down their neck.
 
If DeSantis has designs on the Presidency -- and all indications are that he does -- I'd like one of his supporters to explain to me how initiatives like this help him achieve that goal in any way, shape, or form.

It's like Republicans have forgotten how you win general elections.
 
If DeSantis has designs on the Presidency -- and all indications are that he does -- I'd like one of his supporters to explain to me how initiatives like this help him achieve that goal in any way, shape, or form.

It's like Republicans have forgotten how you win general elections.
It's how private enterprises "trim the fat"... Eliminating current positions (including the people who hold those positions), creating "new" roles (essentially the same job with a "modified" job descriptions), and asking everyone to re-apply for the new roles while opening the jobs to anyone outside of the company.

The avg to high performers will be rehired, the ones that can't carry their weight (say bottom 10% of performers) are not rehired and replaced with someone else that meet qualifications, expecting to be better than the 10% just let go.

Some say it's cruel, some say it's how companies stay competitive.
 
It's how private enterprises "trim the fat"... Eliminating current positions (including the people who hold those positions), creating "new" roles (essentially the same job with a "modified" job descriptions), and asking everyone to re-apply for the new roles while opening the jobs to anyone outside of the company.

The avg to high performers will be rehired, the ones that can't carry their weight (say bottom 10% of performers) are not rehired and replaced with someone else that meet qualifications, expecting to be better than the 10% just let go.

Some say it's cruel, some say it's how companies stay competitive.
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WTF is this neutral unbiased observer blabbing about now?
Don't look for sound-off approval from the echo chamber... Your posts are typically insightful, thought provoking.

The Twitter post someone shared above about terminating faculty positions is how big corporate works, a loop hole in HR world I suppose... not sure how else to spell it out for some that may not be in big enterprise.
 
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