Good thing California has strict gun laws

[cnsaguy]

It could have been at least 15 killed if they didn't.

At least 12 people were killed and at least 10 others injured when a gunman burst into a packed Southern California bar overnight and opened fire, authorities said.

The lone suspect was found dead inside the Borderline Bar and Grill in Thousand Oaks, police said.

Sgt. Ron Helus, a 29-year veteran who was about to retire, was among the dozen killed, according to the Ventura County Sheriff's Department.

link

 

[UCFWayne]

these people should just kill themselves instead of taking others with them.

 

[fried-chicken]

Do we know if this was ISIS or GOP yet?

 

[Jedi.Knight]

Do we know if this was ISIS or GOP yet?

Probably one of those antifa nutjobs like the last idiot that opened fire.

 

[fried-chicken]

This is the deadliest mass shooting in American history in the last week and a half.

Please pray harder guys it doesn't seem to be working.

 

[UCFKnight85]

This is the deadliest mass shooting in American history in the last week and a half.

Please pray harder guys it doesn't seem to be working.

It's amazing how utterly disgusting you respond to these things. And for being a "Christian" you sure shit on prayer a lot. I smell bullshit.

And we now know that the guy was a retired Marine, used one single handgun, and drove his mother's car to the bar. So it's probably not a wild assumption to say that he was suffering from PTSD and living at home to be cared for.

 

[fried-chicken]

It's amazing how utterly disgusting you respond to these things. And for being a "Christian" you sure shit on prayer a lot. I smell bullshit.

And we now know that the guy was a retired Marine, used one single handgun, and drove his mother's car to the bar. So it's probably not a wild assumption to say that he was suffering from PTSD and living at home to be cared for.

Prayer alone never gets the job done. He shouldn't have been able to buy a gun. He had a mental health evaluation and that evaluation was a failure. Since we are failing to identify threats through police calls to homes and mental health evaluation it's time to become more strict in those regards. We need guidelines on how situations like this are taken care of. Prayer won't do any of that.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Prayer alone never gets the job done. He shouldn't have been able to buy a gun. He had a mental health evaluation and that evaluation was a failure. Since we are failing to identify threats through police calls to homes and mental health evaluation it's time to become more strict in those regards. We need guidelines on how situations like this are taken care of. Prayer won't do any of that.

Interesting that you know so much already. Do tell: where'd he "buy" the gun? When was he last mentally evaluated? Was he a felon? Which CA laws were already in place that failed to stop this? Why didn't those laws, the strictest int he country, stop him? Why did he pick this bar? What was his motive?

You know everything about this already so please answer.

 

[NinjaKnight]

Evidently there was a survivor of the LA shooting that was in the bar as well

#murica

 

[fried-chicken]

Interesting that you know so much already. Do tell: where'd he "buy" the gun? When was he last mentally evaluated? Was he a felon? Which CA laws were already in place that failed to stop this? Why didn't those laws, the strictest int he country, stop him? Why did he pick this bar? What was his motive?

You know everything about this already so please answer.

Many of these questions are already answered but I'm not your monkey. Get googling.

 

[crambone]

Not this ish again.

 

[anon_ki59ERik4csguoSd]

This was a friend of a friend. Former military. She said he had PTSD and had been seeking treatment for awhile because he knew he was messed up, but was getting the run around from the VA, and wasn't getting the healthcare he needed.

 

[Crazyhole]

This was a friend of a friend. Former military. She said he had PTSD and had been seeking treatment for awhile because he knew he was messed up, but was getting the run around from the VA, and wasn't getting the healthcare he needed.

I wonder what happens in a persons mind, PTSD or not, that leads them to go out and kill people indiscriminately. Is it rage?

 

[anon_ki59ERik4csguoSd]

I wonder what happens in a persons mind, PTSD or not, that leads them to go out and kill people indiscriminately. Is it rage?

Ya, no clue. That bar is 10 minutes away, and my friend goes there frequently, and so do her parents. It's sad that the dude knew he wasn't in good shape, but couldn't get the help. I'm not anti-gun, but I do think there should be some form of testing, like we do with driver's licenses, to make sure that mentally ill aren't allowed to own firearms.

 

[Crazyhole]

Ya, no clue. That bar is 10 minutes away, and my friend goes there frequently, and so do her parents. It's sad that the dude knew he wasn't in good shape, but couldn't get the help. I'm not anti-gun, but I do think there should be some form of testing, like we do with driver's licenses, to make sure that mentally ill aren't allowed to own firearms.

I dont know if I can agree with the idea that he couldnt get help, but its definitely possible that some people are beyond any level of help I guess. Very sad that anyone could get to the point of thinking that killing a bunch of people is a solution to any problem. Gun or not, law or not, something isnt right here.

 

[anon_ki59ERik4csguoSd]

I don't disagree that he COULDN'T get help. I'm saying it's unfortunate, that he tried to get help, but apparently the VA wasn't providing.

 

[sk8knight]

Ya, no clue. That bar is 10 minutes away, and my friend goes there frequently, and so do her parents. It's sad that the dude knew he wasn't in good shape, but couldn't get the help. I'm not anti-gun, but I do think there should be some form of testing, like we do with driver's licenses, to make sure that mentally ill aren't allowed to own firearms.

Depends on where you are, but this is the case already. In Florida, police can seize a gun from someone they are Baker-acting and hold it for 72 hours. They can also petition for a risk protection order that makes it illegal to possess guns for up to a year.

Which might protect some but it does nothing to solve the initial problem that’s causing the violence. Even if all gun possession was illegal, people would obtain and use guns to kill others. Most gun crime today is perpetrated by people who obtained their weapon illegally.

Rather than attacking the tool, we need to focus on the intent. I agree that we should make it harder for known risky people to get the tools, but that should not be the sole or primary focus. Treat the disease more than the symptom.

 

[anon_ki59ERik4csguoSd]

Even if all gun possession was illegal, people would obtain and use guns to kill others. Most gun crime today is perpetrated by people who obtained their weapon illegally.

While I agree with most of what you say, no need to spread misinformation. More than 80% of shootings are committed with guns attained legally, not the other way around. (https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/s...-used-mass-shootings-obtained-legally-n474441)

Why have speed limits? People still break them.

The answer is deterrence. When speed limits were first put in place, deaths dropped dramatically in car crashes. That's why we have laws. The whole "criminals don't follow laws" rebuke is b.s. As long as we have guns, there will be gun fatalities, so if we want to keep guns, the best we can do is lower the number, and that's where we need to start.

 

[UCFKnight85]

While I agree with most of what you say, no need to spread misinformation. More than 80% of shootings are committed with guns attained legally, not the other way around. (https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/s...-used-mass-shootings-obtained-legally-n474441)

Why have speed limits? People still break them.

The answer is deterrence. When speed limits were first put in place, deaths dropped dramatically in car crashes. That's why we have laws. The whole "criminals don't follow laws" rebuke is b.s. As long as we have guns, there will be gun fatalities, so if we want to keep guns, the best we can do is lower the number, and that's where we need to start.

You do realize that it’s not possible to seize or restrict someone’s guns on a mental health basis if our mental health workers continue failing to recognize sick people when called to do so? This is just one example but we see this all the time. People worried about soneone, requesting mental health intervention, but having the case worker walk away having done nothing.

From the LA TIMES:

Neighbors on his manicured, leafy street said they suspected he had emotional issues. Deputies who were called to Long’s home in April for a complaint of disturbing the peace said he was irate and was acting irrationally, Dean said. Mental health workers decided he did not meet the standard for an emergency psychiatric hold.

 

[sk8knight]

While I agree with most of what you say, no need to spread misinformation. More than 80% of shootings are committed with guns attained legally, not the other way around. (https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/s...-used-mass-shootings-obtained-legally-n474441)

Why have speed limits? People still break them.

The answer is deterrence. When speed limits were first put in place, deaths dropped dramatically in car crashes. That's why we have laws. The whole "criminals don't follow laws" rebuke is b.s. As long as we have guns, there will be gun fatalities, so if we want to keep guns, the best we can do is lower the number, and that's where we need to start.

You posted stats about mass shootings. I was talking about all shootings. There’s no misinformation there. Most shootings are not mass shootings. We don’t ever talk about the people killed all year, just mass shootings.

Drugs are illegal. There have been varying strengths of deterrent throughout the decades. How’s that working for us?

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

It could have been at least 15 killed if they didn't.

At least 12 people were killed and at least 10 others injured when a gunman burst into a packed Southern California bar overnight and opened fire, authorities said.

The lone suspect was found dead inside the Borderline Bar and Grill in Thousand Oaks, police said.

Sgt. Ron Helus, a 29-year veteran who was about to retire, was among the dozen killed, according to the Ventura County Sheriff's Department.

link

Guns laws are most effective when they are country wide or national (think about it)

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

While I agree with most of what you say, no need to spread misinformation. More than 80% of shootings are committed with guns attained legally, not the other way around. (https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/s...-used-mass-shootings-obtained-legally-n474441)

Why have speed limits? People still break them.

The answer is deterrence. When speed limits were first put in place, deaths dropped dramatically in car crashes. That's why we have laws. The whole "criminals don't follow laws" rebuke is b.s. As long as we have guns, there will be gun fatalities, so if we want to keep guns, the best we can do is lower the number, and that's where we need to start.

If you make zero common sense gun laws for the nation, you get zero results or increased gun deaths. If you implement a system like japan or a good common sense gun control plan and there is a 30% to 60% reduction in mass killings.....that is better than doing nothing (like the terrorist group called the NRA wants to do).

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

Prayer alone never gets the job done. He shouldn't have been able to buy a gun. He had a mental health evaluation and that evaluation was a failure. Since we are failing to identify threats through police calls to homes and mental health evaluation it's time to become more strict in those regards. We need guidelines on how situations like this are taken care of. Prayer won't do any of that.

THE REDHATS LIKE TO SEND THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS AFTER MASS KILLINGS AND Angry White Man shootings. That's their gun control plan. SMFH

 

[UCFWayne]

THE REDHATS LIKE TO SEND THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS AFTER MASS KILLINGS AND Angry White Man shootings. That's their gun control plan. SMFH

you sound like an angry white man

 

[sk8knight]

If you make zero common sense gun laws for the nation, you get zero results or increased gun deaths. If you implement a system like japan or a good common sense gun control plan and there is a 30% to 60% reduction in mass killings.....that is better than doing nothing (like the terrorist group called the NRA wants to do).

What makes you think there aren't "common sense" gun laws already in place in this nation?

I love that two of the places that people love to refer to on gun control are both islands and one of them "japan" goes right along with the rest of them as being ethnically homogeneous. None of those countries also has the world's largest black market for guns right next door, nor the problems we have with organized crime syndicates treating our border like it doesn't exist to smuggle in nearly anything.

But sure, keep calling for gun confiscations to make yourselves feel better while doing absolutely nothing to address the underlying reasons that people are acting out violently in our society.

 

[UCFKnight85]

you sound like an angry white man

The guy chimes in with 4-5 posts in a row usually, all of them more incoherent and angry than the last. He's what I imagine a really pissed off 10 year old would sound like if trying to repeat the leftie talking points that their mom yells at them 20 hours a day.

 

[Knight_Light]

If you make zero common sense gun laws for the nation, you get zero results or increased gun deaths. If you implement a system like japan or a good common sense gun control plan and there is a 30% to 60% reduction in mass killings.....that is better than doing nothing (like the terrorist group called the NRA wants to do).

And I always thought common sense laws were already on the books nationwide...like Murder is illegal, no? (punishment does vary though from state to state).

 

[UCFBS]

FACT: The shooter should have been denied the right to buy a firearm, but the military never completed the paperwork to the NCIC.
FACT: This is the biggest 'loophole' of all, that nearly half of the mass shooters have falling through.
FACT: Enforce the existing laws, including ensuring paperwork is correct, and we cut these in half overnight.

If you make zero common sense gun laws for the nation, you get zero results or increased gun deaths.

Define "common sense gun laws"?
Every time someone starts talking about those -- in detail -- even Canadians and Europeans cringe at some of the 'arguments.'

Like 'assault weapons' which includes a lot of legal firearms in Canada and Europe.
He used a 45 ACP, with an illegal magazine, among other things.

Illegal, illegal and ... oh yeah, more illegal ... which laws didn't do anything to stop.
Revolvers and shotguns are pretty effective too, as were the 'pistol' 9mm weapons in Columbine.

If you implement a system like japan

You mean a country with 3x as many suicides? With violence that takes other forms? It's a culture thing more than anything.

What's more likely to happen is the Philippines, which has similar organized crime and drug-related violence, to the US. I.e., the US is more like the Philippines, crime-wise, than Europe -- let alone Japan.

And ... again ... he should have been denied the right to even purchase his 45.

or a good common sense gun control plan and there is a 30% to 60% reduction in mass killings.....

But are "mass killings" the mainstay of gun crime?

Everyone quotes Australia, but doesn't want to talk about how home invasions have gone up since '96, and the gun homicide rate remains unchanged, a slow, steady decline since the '70s -- like all western nations.

that is better than doing nothing (like the terrorist group called the NRA wants to do).

Forget the NRA for a moment ...

What about the USCCA?
What about the NSSF?

Are you against them too?
Are they 'terrorist groups' as well?

HINT: The USCCA has had more pro-gun laws passed the past decade, than the NRA, by a wide margin -- including the ones the US media blames the NRA for, but they were started by the USCCA. The USCCA were also the first ones with "liability insurance." The NSSF is building a number of legal cases, and may actually look to criminal charges over torts and other, illegal activities by companies, even governments.

Stop supporting illegal activities that are now even state sanctioned (I'm looking at you New York), and start focusing on enforcing existing laws. The answer is not to illegally and wrongfully bankrupt gun companies, and even Bernie Sanders points that out.

 

[sk8knight]

He used a 45 ACP, with an illegal magazine, among other things.

That illegal magazine is an example of a "common-sense" gun law that is unenforceable as a prohibition and will only ever be reactive. The manufacture of magazines is quite simple for a metal-worker, even easier if you have a 3-D printer, so there will always be a black market for these items because you can't legislate away demand. Also, they're forcing a confiscation of these magazines from the overwhelming majority of people who have proven throughout the years to be able to responsibly own these magazines without using them against another living organism.

In addition, the laws are often written horribly and collect many firearms that most would not think should be illegal. For example, a 10-round limit makes a large number of semi-automatic handguns illegal in their standard design. Gun "control" advocates have no issue with this but this is the kind of thing that makes 2A supporters feel like the ultimate goal is to make all guns illegal.

 

[UCFBS]

That illegal magazine is an example of a "common-sense" gun law that is unenforceable as a prohibition and will only ever be reactive. The manufacture of magazines is quite simple for a metal-worker, even easier if you have a 3-D printer, so there will always be a black market for these items because you can't legislate away demand. Also, they're forcing a confiscation of these magazines from the overwhelming majority of people who have proven throughout the years to be able to responsibly own these magazines without using them against another living organism.

In addition, the laws are often written horribly and collect many firearms that most would not think should be illegal. For example, a 10-round limit makes a large number of semi-automatic handguns illegal in their standard design. Gun "control" advocates have no issue with this but this is the kind of thing that makes 2A supporters feel like the ultimate goal is to make all guns illegal.

That goes along with my favorite, "Only load 7 cartridges into a 10 round magazine."

Ive cornered so many "common sense" idiots on that one, and even has people laughing at them. "What criminal shooting is going to follow that one? Really?!"

 

[sk8knight]

That goes along with my favorite, "Only load 7 cartridges into a 10 round magazine."

Ive cornered so many "common sense" idiots on that one, and even has people laughing at them. "Why criminal shooting is going to follow that one? Really?!"

Texas has a law for shotguns that, when hunting, you must have a plug inserted that limits the shotgun's capacity to only 3 rounds. People violate that law all of the time. When people violate that law, they are able to take more game which can have an effect on the overall population. AFAIK, there is no law requiring a plug for home or property defense.

Some would think this is common sense for all weapons. Let's say that you require a plug for all magazines that limits them arbitrarily to 6 rounds (same as a .38 revolver). Now let's say you're in a defense scenario where the criminal doesn't have a plug but you do. On their 9mm, they're 14 rounds to 6. Add another magazine or another shooter and its 28 - 6. What if there are 2 perpetrators in the home invasion? You've got 6 rounds while they've got 28 or more. You'd better damn well be a good shot or really practiced at changing out your magazines.

Or worse, they just take your guns entirely and then where are you?

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

What makes you think there aren't "common sense" gun laws already in place in this nation?

I love that two of the places that people love to refer to on gun control are both islands and one of them "japan" goes right along with the rest of them as being ethnically homogeneous. None of those countries also has the world's largest black market for guns right next door, nor the problems we have with organized crime syndicates treating our border like it doesn't exist to smuggle in nearly anything.

But sure, keep calling for gun confiscations to make yourselves feel better while doing absolutely nothing to address the underlying reasons that people are acting out violently in our society.

Wanna see common sense gun laws...look at japan.

 

[sk8knight]

Wanna see common sense gun laws...look at japan.

I love that you question the intelligence of other people on this board.

 

[DaShuckster]

When it comes to mass shootings, the underlying issue that always gets overwhelmed by all the gun chatter is the way our society treats people with mental health problems.

In the aftermath of these massacres, we learn that there were 'telltale' signs that were ignored. As long as this keeps happening and guns are as available as they are, mass shootings will continue.

 

[UCFWayne]

we used to have insane asylums. i know there was a lot of abuse in them, thats why they closed. but i think we need to bring them back. you can call them mental health facilities or whatever i dont care, but we need them back.

 

[fried-chicken]

we used to have insane asylums. i know there was a lot of abuse in them, thats why they closed. but i think we need to bring them back. you can call them mental health facilities or whatever i dont care, but we need them back.

"Bring back insane asylums"

What a take. Wow.

 

[UCFWayne]

"Bring back insane asylums"

What a take. Wow.

yea a place where people with mental health problems can go and try to work through them. what a terrible idea. you are so caught up on the name you cant look past it to the idea. hell i even offered up a pc name for you, but then again youre just a troll.

 

[fried-chicken]

yea a place where people with mental health problems can go and try to work through them. what a terrible idea. you are so caught up on the name you cant look past it to the idea. hell i even offered up a pc name for you, but then again youre just a troll.

Instead of slowing the purchase of guns until you can make sure people are deemed mentally stable, your solution is locking up people who are mentally unstable but don't pose a public threat so you can preserve the ability to buy guns unrestricted.

 

[fried-chicken]

Listen up here now y'all. We jus need to keep guns outta the hands of crazy people. We can't do anything that causes the sale of guns to be impacted cuz then we'd be tramplin people's rights so I'm thinkin we jus lock all the crazy folk up even before they have caused any harm.

 

[fried-chicken]

I almost forgot, were going to call them brain fixin resorts so the libtard progressive Clinton media don't find out bout nuthin.