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UCF vs TCU

I think Illinois State was a tougher test than TCU. It was a true road game (not neutral site) against an opponent that was 17-1 in their conference and a bubble NCAA at large team with a top 40 RPI. TCU will no doubt be a tougher game than a home game against Illinois though.

I will say TCU has been battle tested though and has a few big wins. They are 3-11 against RPI top 50 (we are 2-4).
 
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I think Illinois State was a tougher test than TCU. It was a true road game (not neutral site) against an opponent that was 17-1 in their conference and a bubble NCAA at large team with a top 40 RPI. TCU will no doubt be a tougher game than a home game against Illinois though.

I will say TCU has been battle tested though and has a few big wins. They are 3-11 against RPI top 50 (we are 2-4).
TCU is a hard team to assess. Even the computer rankings have them all over the place: 39th, 51st, and 67th.

On the one hand, they crashed and burned in the Big 12 finishing 6-12, tied for 7th out of only 10 schools; they lost 8 of their last 9 and only got a split with one of the top 5 conference teams. They knocked KU out of the Big 12 tourney only because their best player was suspended. Their OOC record was 11-1 because they, like Illinois only played two away games, losing the one at SMU by 15. Their only OOC quality win was over Ill St. (but TCU's was at home). Their OT win at Iowa on Sunday is one of their 3 best wins. On the other hand, the Big 12, despite what the media claims, was the best conference (by a clear margin according to Sagarin over ACC). It's a ten-school conference with 6 in the NCAAs, 3 of which made the Sweet 16 (vs. only 1 from the ACC).
 
IF we win the NIT, would we crack the top 25?
Unlike football, most computer rankings (like RPI) and weekly coaching poll halt in the basketball "post-season") because things are decided on the court. The exception is the BPI, where we picked up 2 more places to 62nd, passing 63rd Illinois (which stayed the same) and 64th Illinois State (which fell 3 places). TCU rose 3 more to 51st. The biggest gains near the top were by S. Carolina, UF, WVU, Kansas, Oregon, UCLA, Xavier. Bakersfield shot up by 15, and Colorado rose by 5. These are changes over the past 7 days.
 
RPI doesn't halt in the postseason as it is a calculation and not based on voting. Currently UCF sits at 58 in RPI up 11 spots since the NIT started. TCU is 56 (also up 11 spots since NIT started).
 
The winner of the NCAA's is then challenged by the NIT champ. Actually until the mid-1950s, the NIT was a lot more prestigious, and schools could play in both. Then the point-shaving scandal broke, players went to jail, and the NCAA became the single tournament to determine national championships. Now the NIT is also run by the NCAA, too.
 
It's the TCU coach's first year there. He coached Pittsburgh for 13 years. He was Big East Coach of the Year in 2004, Naismith Coach of the Year in 2009, Jim Phelan Coach of the Year in 2010, and Sporting News Coach of the Year in 2011, took a team to the Elite 8 and two others to the Sweet Sixteen, 11 NCAA tournaments, and a career 72% win record (350 wins). He's coached in the Garden many times. Sure glad we have a Coach Dawkins to face off against him.
 
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Regardless of final ranking, this NIT performance can only help Dawkins get a quality HS player, or transfer, with that one last scholarship that he has to offer for next year.
 
Regardless of final ranking, this NIT performance can only help Dawkins get a quality HS player, or transfer, with that one last scholarship that he has to offer for next year.
And hasten his return to the P5, especially after his son graduates. Remember that Dawkins (and Frost) were hired while a Big12 expansion seemed probable, and UCF appeared to be a strong candidate. Also, the AAC had been getting 4 or more NCAA Tournament invitations (unlike this year's pitiful 2). Illinois just grabbed up Oklahoma State's coach (after only one year there) for $18 million over 6 years. There definitely will be good P5 offers to Johnny that we can't possibly match (even a return to Duke should Coach K's back problems continue).

That's why it was so beneficial to get a quick turnaround in wins on the court, interest in ticket sales, community support, recruiting success, and media attention for our basketball program. We've seen such success to survive a coach's departure.
 
And hasten his return to the P5, especially after his son graduates. Remember that Dawkins (and Frost) were hired while a Big12 expansion seemed probable, and UCF appeared to be a strong candidate. Also, the AAC had been getting 4 or more NCAA Tournament invitations (unlike this year's pitiful 2). Illinois just grabbed up Oklahoma State's coach (after only one year there) for $18 million over 6 years. There definitely will be good P5 offers to Johnny that we can't possibly match (even a return to Duke should Coach K's back problems continue).

That's why it was so beneficial to get a quick turnaround in wins on the court, interest in ticket sales, community support, recruiting success, and media attention for our basketball program. We've seen such success to survive a coach's departure.

Think youre putting a little too much weight into the whole Big 12 thing. These coaches know that even if we made the big 12, it would dissolve by the time they got a 2-3 years of coaching in. They know more than us as far as the future of the program, expansion, etc.
They came here for a short list of reason.
1. Central Florida is a hot bed of athletes that has yet to be truly tapped.
2. Anyone from the north who isnt crazy doesnt actually WANT to live up north. (ex. Theres a reason most business are throwing offices into florida, theres no reason to be in chicago and new york anymore. Technology eliminated the need to be in big hubs, so now theyd rather enjoy themselves in nice weather.)
3. Refer to #1, even a mediocre 3 star in florida is equivalent to a 4 star in most states.
 
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Think youre putting a little too much weight into the whole Big 12 thing. These coaches know that even if we made the big 12, it would dissolve by the time they got a 2-3 years of coaching in. They know more than us as far as the future of the program, expansion, etc.
They came here for a short list of reason.
1. Central Florida is a hot bed of athletes that has yet to be truly tapped.
2. Anyone from the north who isnt crazy doesnt actually WANT to live up north. (ex. Theres a reason most business are throwing offices into florida, theres no reason to be in chicago and new york anymore. Technology eliminated the need to be in big hubs, so now theyd rather enjoy themselves in nice weather.)
3. Refer to #1, even a mediocre 3 star in florida is equivalent to a 4 star in most states.
We're not a hot bed for basketball talent, and the standard dismissal on the Forum is Florida doesn't care about basketball
UCF was/is dying to get into the Big12. More than ever before, it's make the P5 or be ignore as low-budget and 2nd class
Much higher wages in non-Southern cities, especially D.C., NYC, Boston, Minneapolis, Seattle, San Francisco, and Philly
 
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We're not a hot bed for basketball talent, and the standard dismissal on the Forum is Florida doesn't care about basketball
UCF was/is dying to get into the Big12. More than ever before, it's make the P5 or be ignore as low-budget and 2nd class
Much higher wages in non-Southern cities, especially D.C., NYC, Boston, Minneapolis, Seattle, San Francisco, and Philly

And equally MUCH higher cost of living and cost to raise a family. Add into the fact that minus san francisco and maybe minneapolis, the crime rates are considerably higher, the weather sucks, and in all of those cities, a closet sized apartment is 3k per month. Not to mention a house, if youre under 1 million, youre in the slums or getting a 1 bedroom, or living 2 hours outside the city.

Cost of living is ridiculous up north, lived there 18 years til i came to college here. Cost vs benefits is much more skewed up north.
 
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And equally MUCH higher cost of living and cost to raise a family. Add into the fact that minus san francisco and maybe minneapolis, the crime rates are considerably higher, the weather sucks, and in all of those cities, a closet sized apartment is 3k per month. Not to mention a house, if youre under 1 million, youre in the slums or getting a 1 bedroom, or living 2 hours outside the city.

Cost of living is ridiculous up north, lived there 18 years til i came to college here. Cost vs benefits is much more skewed up north.
Bullcrap. Check the data sometime instead of repeating what you heard. My kids live in these cities and I visit. Rents no higher than Orlando, now among the tightest markets in the nation since the real estate bubble bust threw homeowners onto the rental market. Record population growth has also contributed to the doubling of rents. Google it. Eating out? Prices are jacked us by our classification as a travel destination market. My recent trips to Manhattan and D.C. found lower prices at the franchise eateries. Florida has the highest energy prices (and airconditioners run year round) because utilities block much cheaper natural gas.
 
Think youre putting a little too much weight into the whole Big 12 thing. These coaches know that even if we made the big 12, it would dissolve by the time they got a 2-3 years of coaching in. They know more than us as far as the future of the program, expansion, etc.
They came here for a short list of reason.
1. Central Florida is a hot bed of athletes that has yet to be truly tapped.
2. Anyone from the north who isnt crazy doesnt actually WANT to live up north. (ex. Theres a reason most business are throwing offices into florida, theres no reason to be in chicago and new york anymore. Technology eliminated the need to be in big hubs, so now theyd rather enjoy themselves in nice weather.)
3. Refer to #1, even a mediocre 3 star in florida is equivalent to a 4 star in most states.
UCF needs to change names if it wants P5 respect.
 
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Bullcrap. Check the data sometime instead of repeating what you heard. My kids live in these cities and I visit. Rents no higher than Orlando, now among the tightest markets in the nation since the real estate bubble bust threw homeowners onto the rental market. Record population growth has also contributed to the doubling of rents. Google it. Eating out? Prices are jacked us by our classification as a travel destination market. My recent trips to Manhattan and D.C. found lower prices at the franchise eateries. Florida has the highest energy prices (and airconditioners run year round) because utilities block much cheaper natural gas.

There's a lot of false in that paragraph
 
Bullcrap. Check the data sometime instead of repeating what you heard. My kids live in these cities and I visit. Rents no higher than Orlando, now among the tightest markets in the nation since the real estate bubble bust threw homeowners onto the rental market. Record population growth has also contributed to the doubling of rents. Google it. Eating out? Prices are jacked us by our classification as a travel destination market. My recent trips to Manhattan and D.C. found lower prices at the franchise eateries. Florida has the highest energy prices (and airconditioners run year round) because utilities block much cheaper natural gas.
Actual median rental values in the cities you list as of March 2017

Orlando 1 BR $1120 2 BR $1290
Washington DC 1 BR $2150 2 BR $3060
NY City 1 BR $3200 2 BR $4100
Boston 1 BR $2800 2 BR $3400
Minneapolis 1 BR $1380 2 BR $1730
Seattle 1 BR $1680 2 BR $2250
San Fran 1 BR $3400 2 BR $4600
Philly ! BR $1400 2 BR $1820
 
Actual median rental values in the cities you list as of March 2017

Orlando 1 BR $1120 2 BR $1290
Washington DC 1 BR $2150 2 BR $3060
NY City 1 BR $3200 2 BR $4100
Boston 1 BR $2800 2 BR $3400
Minneapolis 1 BR $1380 2 BR $1730
Seattle 1 BR $1680 2 BR $2250
San Fran 1 BR $3400 2 BR $4600
Philly ! BR $1400 2 BR $1820
Nice list of old data. Sentinel's Real Estate edition just published this year's rents. Also, the metro areas have much more affordable rates than those listed. My kid's 20 minutes from downtown DC in an 850 sq ft 1 BR for $950. Unlike Orlando, these places listed have fast public transit, so you don't need a car/insurance/parking/gas. Relevant trivia: Orlando has more miles of toll road than any city on the planet.
 
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Think youre putting a little too much weight into the whole Big 12 thing. These coaches know that even if we made the big 12, it would dissolve by the time they got a 2-3 years of coaching in. They know more than us as far as the future of the program, expansion, etc.
They came here for a short list of reason.
1. Central Florida is a hot bed of athletes that has yet to be truly tapped.
2. Anyone from the north who isnt crazy doesnt actually WANT to live up north. (ex. Theres a reason most business are throwing offices into florida, theres no reason to be in chicago and new york anymore. Technology eliminated the need to be in big hubs, so now theyd rather enjoy themselves in nice weather.)
3. Refer to #1, even a mediocre 3 star in florida is equivalent to a 4 star in most states.
Businesses are coming to Florida for Tax Breaks and deals set up by counties. Not weather.
 
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Businesses are coming to Florida for Tax Breaks and deals set up by counties. Not weather.
Businesses come to Florida because SubChapter S Corps can take advantage of Florida being the only state in the region without a state income tax. Also, nearly half the population growth is migration from Puerto Rico, with many of them setting up small businesses. The Florida Speaker is about to close Enterprise Florida and its business recruiting fund.
 
So what do we know about TCU?

Only looking at their stats. Looks like they play 8-9 players. 2 smaller guards and 2 tallish wingers and a 6'11 forward who might be their best player. So a taller front court than average. They spread the points around and have lots of assists.

What type of style do they play? Who has watched them? What's your impression.
 
So what do we know about TCU?

Only looking at their stats. Looks like they play 8-9 players. 2 smaller guards and 2 tallish wingers and a 6'11 forward who might be their best player. So a taller front court than average. They spread the points around and have lots of assists.

What type of style do they play? Who has watched them? What's your impression.
 
Nice list of old data. Sentinel's Real Estate edition just published this year's rents. Also, the metro areas have much more affordable rates than those listed. My kid's 20 minutes from downtown DC in an 850 sq ft 1 BR for $950. Unlike Orlando, these places listed have fast public transit, so you don't need a car/insurance/parking/gas. Relevant trivia: Orlando has more miles of toll road than any city on the planet.
well its only the median rents as of march 2017. Certainly there will be instances of lower or higher rents as your "kids" can attest.
 
well its only the median rents as of march 2017. Certainly there will be instances of lower or higher rents as your "kids" can attest.
My daughter paid $2400 for a shared 2-bedroom in Brooklyn just across the bridge and 10 feet from the subway, but she made do with no help from us. Even had our old van parked with a friend when she had work out of town.
 
Alright I'm going to stop this rent debate right here.

Salaries matches rents for the most part. They have to. It's Science known as Economics. Otherwise people would just move to the lowest rent area.


Now that is settled, we are facing what looks to be a bigger team. Maybe a ECU or a Houston would be our best opponent comparison to TCU? ECU gave us fits while I think we matched up well vs Houston.
 
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Let's Oversimplify this.

1)TCU beat Kansas and lost to West Virginia by one. That says a lot.Thats all you need to know

2) Orlando is a very cheap place to live, although not the cheapest. Check the cost of living indexes (which compares salaries to rent, food prices, etc.) and it doesn't even compare to the northeast or Cali.
 
Let's Oversimplify this.

1)TCU beat Kansas and lost to West Virginia by one. That says a lot.Thats all you need to know

2) Orlando is a very cheap place to live, although not the cheapest. Check the cost of living indexes (which compares salaries to rent, food prices, etc.) and it doesn't even compare to the northeast or Cali.
TCU did beat Kansas and Kansas State, but overall they were wildly inconsistent. 6-12 in conference and lost 11 of their last 14 regular season games including 11-20 Oklahoma. Kansas loses some headscratchers every year, particularly in neutral site tournament games (see Indiana this year). A win over 30 win Kansas is slightly more impressive than a win over 30 win Cincinnati. Fresno State, Iowa, Richmond was not as difficult a schedule as Colorado, Illinois State, Illinois either. I think TCU is a great team and should be favored. If they shoot 50% and score 85 like they did against Kansas, we won't win. If they shoot 39% and score in the 60s as they did in their previous game against Kansas (lost by 19) we have a great shot to win and make the finals.
 
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2 common opponents Illinois State and SMU
TCU beat Illinois State by 9 @TCU
UCF beat Illinois State by 1 @Illinois State
TCU lost to SMU by 15 @SMU
UCF lost to SMU by 5 @UCF
UCF lost to SMU by 11 neutral site.

Based on these results the teams appear to be relatively evenly matched. Current RPIs are UCF 57 and TCU 59.
 
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2 common opponents Illinois State and SMU
TCU beat Illinois State by 9 @TCU
UCF beat Illinois State by 1 @Illinois State
TCU lost to SMU by 15 @SMU
UCF lost to SMU by 5 @UCF
UCF lost to SMU by 11 neutral site.

Based on these results the teams appear to be relatively evenly matched. Current RPIs are UCF 57 and TCU 59.
Illinois has perhaps the best claim to being our toughest opponent in the NIT because they beat Michigan, Michigan State, swept Northwestern and Iowa, and BYU all in the NCAA tournament or NIT, with Michigan making the sweet sixteen. TCU's Kansas win can be largely attributed to the one game suspension of the Jayhawks' star player. Of course, Illinois St. had the highest ranking but didn't beat anyone.
 
TCU barely beat KU in Big 12 tourney because Josh Jackson was his usual dumb dumb self (I hear all about it from fans as I live in KC) and was suspended. TCU doesn't have good ball movement and relies on 1 on 1 isolation w their albino freshman PG. They do have a few players w a good midrange game that could limit the tacko factor however both teams from Illinois were better on both ends of the court. If we don't choke on the semi big stage it will be a good knight.
 
TCU barely beat KU in Big 12 tourney because Josh Jackson was his usual dumb dumb self (I hear all about it from fans as I live in KC) and was suspended. TCU doesn't have good ball movement and relies on 1 on 1 isolation w their albino freshman PG. They do have a few players w a good midrange game that could limit the tacko factor however both teams from Illinois were better on both ends of the court. If we don't choke on the semi big stage it will be a good knight.
Albino kid is hurt btw.
 
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