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We are in a weird spot...

Ace of Knights

Silver Knight
Sep 6, 2009
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This will be a long read but-

As a UCF fan, I hate where we are in the college football landscape now more than ever and unfortunately, I do believe it is having an effect on both our attendance and our fan base. We are winning. I love it. I love that we are 9-0. But it has come at a cost. I was always in the camp of winning solves everything. That the crowds would come if we consistently win. I'm sorry, but I no longer believe that to be the case. Here's my reasoning:

1. We are in the G5. We've never had much of a bandwagon, non-student/ non-alumni fan base. I always thought if we started winning big we would start seeing new fans. We won't. Locals, fair weather fans, etc. aren't going to show up in droves because UConn, Tulsa, Tulane, the dreggs of our conference aren't draws that get people excited. We will sell out USF, P5 teams, and bring nice crowds for decent teams like Houston, Memphis, and Navy and the homecoming game... but the rest- forget it.

2. The way we are winning is actually starting to keep people away.

Let me preface this by saying, I liked O'Leary. He was what this program needed at the time he was hired. But his style of doing things started to hurt this program in the end especially in recruiting. We struggled to recruit kids to a pro style offense and struggled to recruit Florida in general.

Today that's not the case. Recruiting is booming especially with Florida recruits we previously never had a shot at getting. We have more speed on this team than any team previously. And because we aren't playing in a pro-style offense that won through clock management, we are absolutely destroying teams I argue we always should have.

The problem is, our fans are getting spoiled. The die-hards come all the time, but I actually had a friend tell me yesterday that they didn't want take the time to come today because they "knew we would blow them out and that the game would be over at halftime." Some of this is because it was UConn, noon game, raining, etc and its tied to point #1 about not big draws in the AAC,. But make no mistake about it- a comfort level of we will destroy the weaker competition in our conference is setting in within our fan base. It happened at Oregon too. Their was actual talk of boredom setting in within some of their fan base after blowing people out every week. I hate to say it, if the games aren't close and the excitement of a close win isn't there, some people will be turned off.

3. Ticket prices. I get it, we need money as a program and there is a demand for premium seating. But I know plenty of people who didn't buy season tickets this year because of the price increase. Furthermore, fair-weather fans aren't going to pay a lot of money to come and see us completely destroy UConn where the game is over at half-time.

4. We are now dealing with coaching rumors and other schools circling like vultures. It's uncharted territory for UCF fans and it ties in with being a G5 program. We didn't have to worry about this with O'Leary. I have no idea if Frost will leave after this year. Even if he does, I argue that as long as we hire an offensive minded coach there is no reason we can't keep this train rolling. With our facilities, recruiting grounds, there is no reason we shouldn't dominate this conference. The problem is, if all we become is a training ground for the P5 to steal our coaches every few years, apathy will set in.

Getting into the P5, is an absolute must or I hate to say it but we may start to see fewer and fewer fans at games. Apathy will eventually set in even within the hard core fans because the competition sucks and our coaches will win and then leave. If we had a shot at the playoffs, it would be different but I don't see that happening even if they expand to 8 teams. Like I said, I love winning but as long as we are in the G5 it will continue to be a double edged sword.
 
The Program is basically in College Football Purgatory.

I do agree that the Conference Realignment tease for years and never happening is starting to hurt this fanbase. It will get worse if Frost leaves this quick. It is weird to have so much negativity during an undefeated season but all the noise with the CFP Ranking and Coach rumors it's hard for fans to not get annoyed. Miami gets a big win tonight and they don't have to worry about every article talking about where Richt is coaching next season.
 
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Never cared about data or metrics. You see the short term, Warren Buffet would buy us long.*

I thought this too. I've always believed that as we continue to pump out thousands of alumni year after year that our fan base at games will steadily grow. A part of me still believes that, but i'm starting to question it. We had more fans in the O'Leary years of ground and pound. The students aren't even filling the student section consistently anymore. Their attendance has been declining since week 1 and its been like this since after 2013. And I argue because apathy with our G5 status and the fact that we are blowing people out before half time in most of our games against the dreggs of the AAC is causing people to evaluate their options.
 
I agree with many of the points made in the OP.

Blame the system, not ourselves. If there was clear path to a legit national championship, then almost all of our complaints would be washed away.

It’s like being a black person in the 1940s. You could be top of your HS class and still have little chance of getting into college. Even if you did, what then? There is no good job for you.

We need to start getting really angry about how this corrupt system is designed to keep us down and out.

Really, is there any doubt that the BS Playoffs was to protect the big names teams and tv deals?

This will change. It has to.
 
I agree with many of the points made in the OP.

Not me, lad. Sporting has always been corrupt. Look duck ‘hunting”, the Chicago Black Socks, China Olympians and the USSR. You‘re simply an idealist like I used to be. Now I’m to the point where as long as I get it sucked and drink a few red heavies, zfg.*
 
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I agree with many of the points made in the OP.

Blame the system, not ourselves. If there was clear path to a legit national championship, then almost all of our complaints would be washed away.

It’s like being a black person in the 1940s. You could be top of your HS class and still have little chance of getting into college. Even if you did, what then? There is no good job for you.

We need to start getting really angry about how this corrupt system is designed to keep us down and out.

Really, is there any doubt that the BS Playoffs was to protect the big names teams and tv deals?

This will change. It has to.

At the time I loved the new Playoff over the BCS but it seems this whole media pushed 'hey G5 go away & do your own thing' has become more frequent in the Playoff era .They talk down to UCF like we don't deserve consistent success or a potential Elite HC
 
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At the time I loved the new Playoff over the BCS but it seems this whole media pushed 'hey G5 go away & do your own thing' has become more frequent in the Playoff era .They talk down to UCF like we don't deserve consistent success or a potential Elite HC

Yeah I was naïve and optimistic too. I’m still blown away by how a TV network can control the postseason of a sport. The true intent of the BS Playoff is now undeniable. It’s all about TV viewership. ESP5N will hype of the teams with the biggest fan bases and try to convince everyone a 3 loss big name is better than undefeated team to maximize viewership and make more money.

Even the Bowls are completely dependent on ESP5Ns dollars. Heck the Cure Bowl would choose a 3 win ND vs a 3 win Miami over 2 less populars good teams, if they could.

UCF and the AAC could play a special role in changing this corrupt system. We have the reasourcea to challenge the status quo. We can and have beat the best. We can absolutely put it in everyone’s face that every team deserves a chance. Heritage and history should not give anyone special privileges.

I rather UCF be the catalyst for creating a legit sanctioned national championship than be invited into the “P5” or claim a mythical national championship. That could be the biggest sport’s story in a century.
 
The Program is basically in College Football Purgatory.

I do agree that the Conference Realignment tease for years and never happening is starting to hurt this fanbase. It will get worse if Frost leaves this quick. It is weird to have so much negativity during an undefeated season but all the noise with the CFP Ranking and Coach rumors it's hard for fans to not get annoyed. Miami gets a big win tonight and they don't have to worry about every article talking about where Richt is coaching next season.
Richt played at Miami. You do realize if Sabah leaves Bama there will be hundreds of articles written about just about every good coach leaving their current job to go there. Dabo and Jimbo have already been rumored and Saban isn't gone yet. It's not unique to G5 teams. Not even bad P5 teams.
 
In an interview with Danny White on 740 AM he explained some of the attendance situation. UCF believes that season ticket holders are more valuable than than the casual walk up fans. They took a calculated step to raise the single game prices and hold firm, knowing there would likely be an attendance hit this year, but the bump will come next year.

I hate the crappy crowds too, but I kind of agree with his point. If you have a season ticket you are more likely to show up for most or all the games than if you just bought single game tickets.

In my circle I can already see it is working. I have family members and friends that have all started saying "man, we're just going to buy season tickets next year" because the single game prices are so high.

To the rest of your post though I agree. FSU/UF/Miami don't sell out for their lesser opponents either. There is nothing exciting for the casual fan when playing UCONN, Tulane, Tulsa, SMU, etc.

Our attendance is fine for where we are. It's not fair to compare our attendance against P5. Nebraska's sellout streak would end in 1 season if they played an AAC schedule. Our attendance compared to G5 is pretty much the top. That is the best that we can ever hop for in this dumpy league. The real goal should be getting in a real conference.
 
Yeah I think G5 -> P5 should be the ultimate goal.

It's always funny to see attendance rants on here, because I feel like some people act like after a game all of Orlando said "well I wanted to go but..." when in reality they may not be aware or care that there's a game at all.

In the end, it's entertainment. Not a job or obligation.

Anecdotally I can group potential attendees I know in a few ways:

1. Sports haters: people who would never walk into a game and don't like any sports.

2. Indifferent people whose default is not to go to a game, but if enough friends go they might go once in awhile

3. General sports fans without loyalty to UCF who would go for a big game

4. Actual fans who want to go, but have circumstances that prevent attending frequently, such as money, kids, etc. Or simply don't prioritize going

5. Die-hard season ticket holders who do everything they can to attend.

I myself fall into #4. I live 3 hours away and have a toddler and a limited budget. Years after graduating I went up several times a season and would cajole people into going, even buying group tickets for 20 people a few times. But the reality is it's just entertainment, and after a week of work I often kinda just want to sit at home and watch from there. Maybe if I won the lottery I'd attend more games.

But anyway, I'm rambling. I think a better conference will bump up the attendance people who fall into categories 2-4.
 
Chances of getting into the SEC? I think that would be the best conference for us but Florida would fight it for sure!
 
Remember this in 2 weeks. It was USF that killed the Big East by preventing our invite. We could have had big teams coming to Orlando regularly, but now we get Tulane and ECU and 25,000 fans. Awesome.
 
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To the OP post:
1. We don't want the Walmart fans
2. The way we are winning is perfect. I bet Oregon's fans aren't happy with the change
3. Your friends were just freeloading. I think the cost of 2 tickets in almost any section except the 50-Yd line was almost the same than before. Starting with section 206 and 107, the cost of 4 tickets was about the same than before. The new ticket policy just flushed a bunch of people that weren't donating enough to get 4 seats in the sections they were receiving
 
Two main reasons: G5 after almost being in the big12 and being denied and the price hike. I get it but for the casual fan who doesn’t follow ucf twitter or anything only sees $45 for crappy seats which is a lot for the casual fan and kids. The price hike and moving around for us was a burden and also the ticket office really sucks. I think we should be selling out it’s not the teams fault
 
I thought this too. I've always believed that as we continue to pump out thousands of alumni year after year that our fan base at games will steadily grow. A part of me still believes that, but i'm starting to question it. We had more fans in the O'Leary years of ground and pound. The students aren't even filling the student section consistently anymore. Their attendance has been declining since week 1 and its been like this since after 2013. And I argue because apathy with our G5 status and the fact that we are blowing people out before half time in most of our games against the dreggs of the AAC is causing people to evaluate their options.

As for the students it’s sad. They did better with less section to work with
 
In an interview with Danny White on 740 AM he explained some of the attendance situation. UCF believes that season ticket holders are more valuable than than the casual walk up fans. They took a calculated step to raise the single game prices and hold firm, knowing there would likely be an attendance hit this year, but the bump will come next year.

I hate the crappy crowds too, but I kind of agree with his point. If you have a season ticket you are more likely to show up for most or all the games than if you just bought single game tickets.

In my circle I can already see it is working. I have family members and friends that have all started saying "man, we're just going to buy season tickets next year" because the single game prices are so high.

To the rest of your post though I agree. FSU/UF/Miami don't sell out for their lesser opponents either. There is nothing exciting for the casual fan when playing UCONN, Tulane, Tulsa, SMU, etc.

Our attendance is fine for where we are. It's not fair to compare our attendance against P5. Nebraska's sellout streak would end in 1 season if they played an AAC schedule. Our attendance compared to G5 is pretty much the top. That is the best that we can ever hop for in this dumpy league. The real goal should be getting in a real conference.

I agree with a lot of this. There are people who I know that now regret not buying season tickets this year, with how the season is going. I've heard, "of course this happens the year we don't buy tickets." It was definitely a gamble, risk reward strategy. It very well may pay off. But if, Frost leaves it may backfire.
 
IMHO, you need to do something about prices. Have the entire section behind the goal posts be $20 and see if that sells out. We went yesterday and I dropped $135 for 3 tix in the end zone. I make a good living, but that's insane. There is no way you're getting consistent walk up sales at those prices for most middle class fans.
 
IMHO, you need to do something about prices. Have the entire section behind the goal posts be $20 and see if that sells out. We went yesterday and I dropped $135 for 3 tix in the end zone. I make a good living, but that's insane. There is no way you're getting consistent walk up sales at those prices for most middle class fans.

Especially with the casual fans which a lot of our fans are
 
We went yesterday and I dropped $135 for 3 tix in the end zone
I'm a season ticket holder and if I was a not a season ticketholder with an average or an above average salary, I absolutely would not pay $135 for 3 end zone tickets in the partial rain to see Uconn

With parking and food/drinks that's easily $200

If we were playing a quality P5 opponent, I would gladly pay it
 
speaking of Purgatory was watching the Miami-ND game and they put up the graphic of the non UF-FSU Florida teams doing good and Kirk Herbstreit spent the segment praising Butch Davis and FIU with a little Kiffin sprinkled in & didn't even mention UCF who dropped over 60 points on FIU
 
Remember this in 2 weeks. It was USF that killed the Big East by preventing our invite. We could have had big teams coming to Orlando regularly, but now we get Tulane and ECU and 25,000 fans. Awesome.
Absolutely. NEVER forget usf’s selfish and greedy short-sightedness that not only blew up in their face but led to the implosion of the Big East Conference, which impacted us all horrifically.
 
Absolutely. NEVER forget usf’s selfish and greedy short-sightedness that not only blew up in their face but led to the implosion of the Big East Conference, which impacted us all horrifically.
That would have been a nice conference. WVU and Pitt have a lot of fans already living in Florida, would have helped attendance
 
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To the OP post:
1. We don't want the Walmart fans
2. The way we are winning is perfect. I bet Oregon's fans aren't happy with the change
3. Your friends were just freeloading. I think the cost of 2 tickets in almost any section except the 50-Yd line was almost the same than before. Starting with section 206 and 107, the cost of 4 tickets was about the same than before. The new ticket policy just flushed a bunch of people that weren't donating enough to get 4 seats in the sections they were receiving
I don't like Walmart fans of every team but we need them. That's how a fan base grows.
 
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