Where is the source of contention on immigration exactly?

[Crazyhole]

Bear with me, but I want to try something. I'd like to know where exactly each side and individual diverges on immigration, particularly from the southern border. This will be a progressive line of processes and I think it would be helpful if the individual points are not argued to the point of making the topic go off the rails (wishful thinking). To begin just answer with a yes or no response and when we get to the end we can discuss the details of why people drop off at different levels.

To start: people of hispanic origin (mexico and central america) should be allowed to immigrate to the united states legally.

 

[UCFRogerz]

I'm play along .

Yes.

 

[chemmie]

The contention is Trump's zero tolerance policy on immigration which basically arrests every immigrant coming into the USA who doesnt have the correct paperwork, takes their children away (until yesterday.) and then puts them in the criminal pile so they can never immigrate legally.

 

[UCFWayne]

yes they should be able to immigrate to the us legally.

 

[goodknightfl]

The biggest difference is the press and swamp are in an all out go after Trump mode. Clinton, Bush 2, Obama and Trump all were doing the same thing, as the (((LAW))) requires them. Other than the girls crying, the pictures we have seen are from 2014, (Obama) not today.

 

[chemmie]

No, they weren't doing the same thing. Why do you believe things that aren't true?

 

[UCFKnight85]

yes they should be able to immigrate to the us legally.

And absolutely no one has ever advocated for stopping legal immigration.

 

[fabknight]

Yes. (Although they must be required to learn American English. Assimilation is good.)

 

[Crazyhole]

Ok. So there is a consensus that hispanics should be allowed to immigrate here.


Next question: should there be a determined number of people that we allow to immigrate?

 

[UCFKnight85]

Ok. So there is a consensus that hispanics should be allowed to immigrate here.


Next question: should there be a determined number of people that we allow to immigrate?

Yes. Like every other developed nation.

And based upon needed skills and education level

 

[sk8knight]

In the over-generalized question, yes.

 

[Crazyhole]

In the over-generalized question, yes.

Have to start with generalizations and work towards the smaller issues to find where the point of divergence occurs.

 

[chemmie]

Yes. (Although they must be required to learn American English. Assimilation is good.)

 

[UCFWayne]

Ok. So there is a consensus that hispanics should be allowed to immigrate here.


Next question: should there be a determined number of people that we allow to immigrate?

yes there should be a set amount. there should also be a process to allow more if emergencies come up.

 

[sk8knight]

Have to start with generalizations and work towards the smaller issues to find where the point of divergence occurs.

I figured.

 

[CommuterBob]

So Trump did this today...


Paraded out a bunch of people who had family members "permanently separated" from their families (i.e. killed) by illegal aliens who were criminals. He even appeared to have signed the posters they were holding up. He touted a bunch of statistics about the number of criminals who are illegal aliens and how 90% of the heroin in this country comes across the southern border.

 

[UCFWayne]

So Trump did this today...

View embedded media

Paraded out a bunch of people who had family members "permanently separated" from their families (i.e. killed) by illegal aliens who were criminals. He even appeared to have signed the posters they were holding up. He touted a bunch of statistics about the number of criminals who are illegal aliens and how 90% of the heroin in this country comes across the southern border.

good. people need to be aware of both sides of the illegal immigrant issue. they commit a disproportionate amount of crime. ive heard that stat about heroin a few times now, so even if its not 90, its probably very close. a wall isnt going to stop it all people and drugs crossing, but it will slow it down and thats good enough for me.

 

[CommuterBob]

good. people need to be aware of both sides of the illegal immigrant issue. they commit a disproportionate amount of crime. ive heard that stat about heroin a few times now, so even if its not 90, its probably very close. a wall isnt going to stop it all people and drugs crossing, but it will slow it down and thats good enough for me.

I won't argue that gangs of illegals aren't dangerous. They are. However, this statement as a generalization is more likely not supported by facts.

http://criminology.oxfordre.com/vie...90264079.001.0001/acrefore-9780190264079-e-93

 

[UCFWayne]

I won't argue that gangs of illegals aren't dangerous. They are. However, this statement as a generalization is more likely not supported by facts.

http://criminology.oxfordre.com/vie...90264079.001.0001/acrefore-9780190264079-e-93

32% of illegal aliens make up our prison system. how many illegal aliens are there in this country? 12-15 million? more?

im no math major so maybe you can help me out. what percentage of the population is illegal? is that 4.5% yet they are 32% of our prison population. something doesnt add up there.... it would almost seem like they are more likely to commit crime vs a normal citizen...

 

[CommuterBob]

32% of illegal aliens make up our prison system. how many illegal aliens are there in this country? 12-15 million? more?

im no math major so maybe you can help me out. what percentage of the population is illegal? is that 4.5% yet they are 32% of our prison population. something doesnt add up there.... it would almost seem like they are more likely to commit crime vs a normal citizen...

Uh, no. Yes it's true that undocumented immigrants comprise 32% of the Federal prison population, the Federal population is only 6% of the total prison population of this country - and many of those undocumented immigrants in the population are in Federal prison are there because they're illegal immigrants awaiting trial - not that they've committed other crimes per se. The vast majority of illegal immigrants in the prison population are Hispanic and Hispanics only make up 16% of the US total prison population. That's not to say that all Hispanics are illegals, though. So out of the 56K illegals in the Federal prison system, that makes around 2% of the total inmates are illegals in the US.

 

[UCFKnight85]

So Trump did this today...

View embedded media

Paraded out a bunch of people who had family members "permanently separated" from their families (i.e. killed) by illegal aliens who were criminals. He even appeared to have signed the posters they were holding up. He touted a bunch of statistics about the number of criminals who are illegal aliens and how 90% of the heroin in this country comes across the southern border.

No idea about that heroin stat, but NPR just last week did a story about how so many small towns in this country are going from a small crisis with opioids, to a full blown catastrophe due to low cost meth coming from Mexico.

More and more people are dying here as a result of Mexican meth. Kids’ lives are being ruined. Towns are literally crumbling because so many people are hooked on drugs.

It’s absolutely flooding across the border and it’s lower risk since morons here no longer have to cook it.

So no- every illegal immigrant is not a criminal. But clearly there is a massive problem with drug smuggling and drug mules that abuse our pathetic border security and as a result more American citizens are dying.

Do you not see a problem here ?

 

[CommuterBob]

No idea about that heroin stat, but NPR just last week did a story about how so many small towns in this country are going from a small crisis with opioids, to a full blown catastrophe due to low cost meth coming from Mexico.

More and more people are dying here as a result of Mexican meth. Kids’ lives are being ruined. Towns are literally crumbling because so many people are hooked on drugs.

It’s absolutely flooding across the border and it’s lower risk since morons here no longer have to cook it.

So no- every illegal immigrant is not a criminal. But clearly there is a massive problem with drug smuggling and drug mules that abuse our pathetic border security and as a result more American citizens are dying.

Do you not see a problem here ?

Yes, drug smuggling is a problem. And yes, Mexican meth is pouring into our country. It's a terrible problem. The real problem is the consumption. If people didn't want to consume the drugs, there wouldn't be the fervent demand for them. Illegals aren't coming here and forcing drugs on our population. They're willing buyers. That's a much harder problem to solve though.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Yes, drug smuggling is a problem. And yes, Mexican meth is pouring into our country. It's a terrible problem. The real problem is the consumption. If people didn't want to consume the drugs, there wouldn't be the fervent demand for them. Illegals aren't coming here and forcing drugs on our population. They're willing buyers. That's a much harder problem to solve though.

Dude- you missed the point here. We need to revamp border security, in every way possible, BECAUSE it’s being abused to death by these drug cartels. They have abused the shit out of our system of our catch and release policy. Abused our policy of barely caring if the border is secured or not.

I’m not saying illegal aliens are consuming this stuff. I’m saying the drugs are coming in right along side other illegal aliens, and clearly our government thus far can’t do a damn thing to sort it out or stop it

 

[1ofTheseKnights]

...) should be allowed to immigrate to the united states legally.

In a bigly reduced number, sure. Why does no one ever think: how can we make Meheeco & Central America not suck so they don’t want to come here to our awful racist country?

 

[UCFWayne]

Uh, no. Yes it's true that undocumented immigrants comprise 32% of the Federal prison population, the Federal population is only 6% of the total prison population of this country - and many of those undocumented immigrants in the population are in Federal prison are there because they're illegal immigrants awaiting trial - not that they've committed other crimes per se. The vast majority of illegal immigrants in the prison population are Hispanic and Hispanics only make up 16% of the US total prison population. That's not to say that all Hispanics are illegals, though. So out of the 56K illegals in the Federal prison system, that makes around 2% of the total inmates are illegals in the US.

you dont dispute the 32%. the rest is just a funny way of saying that illegal immigrants commit a disproportionate amount of crime compared to the average citizen.

 

[rediceknight]

yes they should be able to immigrate to the us legally.

No.

 

[rediceknight]

None of the crimes committed by illegal aliens would occur if they were not in the country illegally in the first place.

Moreover, many more illegal alien crimes could be prevented if these illegal aliens were deported as soon as possible after they were caught instead of being given 'sanctuary' and/or turned loose to repeatedly prey on more victims, as was the case in the Shooting of Kathryn Steinle.

Unfortunately, too many American families like that of Kathryn Steinle's know from personal experience about permanent separation, as the rising Death Toll Calculator illustrates:As of today, illegal aliens have murdered more than 2076 people inside the USA in 2018 alone.

They have murdered more than 73548 people inside the USA since 9/11.

These are losses for which there can be no reimbursement.

Notice that the numbers shown do not take into account the many rapes, child molestations, assaults, and other human crimes committed by illegal aliens...

Nor does it show the virtual destruction of the rule of law in this country...

This killing goes on day after day after day: Seven days a week, 365 days a year, year after year after year.

 

[fried-chicken]

None of the crimes committed by illegal aliens would occur if they were not in the country illegally in the first place.

Moreover, many more illegal alien crimes could be prevented if these illegal aliens were deported as soon as possible after they were caught instead of being given 'sanctuary' and/or turned loose to repeatedly prey on more victims, as was the case in the Shooting of Kathryn Steinle.

Unfortunately, too many American families like that of Kathryn Steinle's know from personal experience about permanent separation, as the rising Death Toll Calculator illustrates:As of today, illegal aliens have murdered more than 2076 people inside the USA in 2018 alone.

They have murdered more than 73548 people inside the USA since 9/11.

These are losses for which there can be no reimbursement.

Notice that the numbers shown do not take into account the many rapes, child molestations, assaults, and other human crimes committed by illegal aliens...

Nor does it show the virtual destruction of the rule of law in this country...

This killing goes on day after day after day: Seven days a week, 365 days a year, year after year after year.

Not to nitpick one incorrect fact in a post full of incorrect facts but 73000 people have been murdered by illegal immigrants in the last 17 years?

That's some Facebook meme stat you ignorant pustule.

 

[fried-chicken]

About 15000 people are murdered in America each year for your stat to be correct almost 3 out of every 10 murders would have to be commited by an illegal immigrant. That is a hilariously impossible number.

 

[UCFKnight85]

11 MS13 gang members were charged with the brutal kidnapping and murders of 2 teens that were found dead in the wood.

10 of the 11 gang members are illegal aliens

But when Trump mentions MS13- it’s all just scare mongering! Nancy Pelosi told me that there’s Gods divinity in all of these great people! Calling them animals is racist and wrong!

https://www.google.com/amp/www.foxn...nts-charged-in-deaths-virginia-teens.amp.html

 

[Crazyhole]

Not to nitpick one incorrect fact in a post full of incorrect facts but 73000 people have been murdered by illegal immigrants in the last 17 years?

That's some Facebook meme stat you ignorant pustule.

I believe I read that its something like 500 per year, so more like 8 or 9 thousand total.

 

[CommuterBob]

you dont dispute the 32%. the rest is just a funny way of saying that illegal immigrants commit a disproportionate amount of crime compared to the average citizen.

No. Read the info again. It's not conclusive.

The vast majority of that 32% are not in the system for committing another crime other than being here illegally.

 

[UCFKnight85]

No. Read the info again. It's not conclusive.

The vast majority of that 32% are not in the system for committing another crime other than being here illegally.

It’s almost as if we send people to jail who break our laws

 

[chemmie]

No. Read the info again. It's not conclusive.

The vast majority of that 32% are not in the system for committing another crime other than being here illegally.

Just give up and insult them.
You're writing to people who think that every brown-skinned person should be in prison. There is no help for them.

 

[goodknightfl]

No more walls, no more fences, we should be open to nature, and let in all gods creatures, human and non human. Open our homes, hearts, and lives to all...live as one, Just imagine....

 

[UCFWayne]

No. Read the info again. It's not conclusive.

The vast majority of that 32% are not in the system for committing another crime other than being here illegally.

so did they or did they not break our laws? something about entering our country illegally....