Democratic National Convention

[hemightbejeremy]

Nope. Many, many people make $9-13 dollars an hour including medical assistants. They asked for raises to $14-15 and were told to take a hike. They aren’t paying fast food workers $15 which is a large workforce in America

You are on to something here. The US maintains full employment through huge amounts of obsolete service industry type jobs. This because of the age old philosophy of everybody needs to work a job to contribute to society. I’m fact we are moving forward in technology and jobs are becoming obsolete. The owners of the technologies make billions. With the amount of productivity though technological advances, there is no reason an American should live in poverty. There’s no reason an American should go unfed. UBI will be coming in the future but too many people are set in the old ways and resistant to change.

 

[Ucfmikes]

They need to go to work at Walmart.

I believe Walmart was offering $11 during the height of this pandemic. They weren’t offering $15. If they had to, they wouldn’t have offered as many jobs and guess what those potential employees would be doing??

You guessed it. Nothing. Unemployed.

 

[Ucfmikes]

You are on to something here. The US maintains full employment through huge amounts of obsolete service industry type jobs. This because of the age old philosophy of everybody needs to work a job to contribute to society. I’m fact we are moving forward in technology and jobs are becoming obsolete. The owners of the technologies make billions. With the amount of productivity though technological advances, there is no reason an American should live in poverty. There’s no reason an American should go unfed. UBI will be coming in the future but too many people are set in the old ways and resistant to change.

What you fail to understand is the importance of these low paying jobs for students, the young, and a spouse as a second income. People are basically not working for $8-$9 an hour and 40 hours at that rate as an individual. Probably very few. The ones that are work more hours, for higher pay or multiple jobs

 

[Crazyhole]

I believe Walmart was offering $11 during the height of this pandemic. They weren’t offering $15. If they had to, they wouldn’t have offered as many jobs and guess what those potential employees would be doing??

You guessed it. Nothing. Unemployed.

Can't live off of 11 bucks an hour so it may as well be slave labor but with more starvation. 14 bucks an hour is a total sham as well because how can anybody pay their bills at 14 bucks an hour. 15 guarantees a comfortable living wage. Happiness abounds at 15.

 

[Crazyhole]

If 15 an hour is a living wage, why should anyone make more than that?

 

[hemightbejeremy]

What you fail to understand is the importance of these low paying jobs for students, the young, and a spouse as a second income. People are basically not working for $8-$9 an hour and 40 hours at that rate as an individual. Probably very few. The ones that are work more hours, for higher pay or multiple jobs

What you fail to understand is I didn’t say those jobs were unimportant. I said the US economy relies on a large proportion of low paying service industry jobs in relation to our economic peers. Many of these jobs will eventually be overcome by technology or automation. The solution won’t be to pull new industries out of thin air to support full employment. The solution will be a UBI.

 

[firm_bizzle]

What is your point??? There are a bunch who make $11-13 and have roommates, crappy apartments or are married.

There employers will not pay them $15. The employer will be short staffed or struggle

That is just ONE example

I hire in this field. Our starting pay for someone with 8-months of training out of high school is $16. However, our average pay is $19.50. My goal is to get everyone to $20 by next June. We may have to go higher than that once the $15/hr bill passed this fall. Disney, Universal, City of Orlando and Orange County have all committee to $15/hr.

 

[Ucfmikes]

None of these things are guaranteed to happen at all or anytime soon, yet the increase in minimum wage is an immediate proposal. As far as UBI. It has many flaws including no incentive for people to perform/work. More Americans oppose it than not, so that says something

 

[Ucfmikes]

I hire in this field. Our starting pay for someone with 8-months of training out of high school is $16. However, our average pay is $19.50. My goal is to get everyone to $20 by next June. We may have to go higher than that once the $15/hr bill passed this fall. Disney, Universal, City of Orlando and Orange County have all committee to $15/hr.

Hire in what field? Once everyone goes to $15 an hour, you can say bye to half the the fast food chains for starters. Doctors offices will suffer because they will need to cut staff. Many other businesses that rely on low income jobs will suffer and close. Additionally, many other jobs will need to an increase in pay as a domino effect.

Where do you think this money is going to come from?

 

[hemightbejeremy]

None of these things are guaranteed to happen at all or anytime soon, yet the increase in minimum wage is an immediate proposal. As far as UBI. It has many flaws including no incentive for people to perform/work. More Americans oppose it than not, so that says something

I don’t think you understand what a UBI is. It is an amount that is basic income for everybody. The incentive to perform work is to earn income in excess of the UBI. Unlike welfare which (arguably) could provide an incentive not to work since those working lose the benefit, the UBI would not be lost by choosing to work. Again as we progress further technologically there will be no alternative. Even now we are artificially holding back some automation to allow for (relatively) full employment. Downside is many of these unnecessary jobs are lost in instances like a global pandemic and then you have millions unemployed and have to implement a makeshift UBI anyway.

Also the majority of those under 50 do support a UBI when polled. But only 21% of those over retirement age (and thus already eligible for collecting SS) supported it.

 

[Ucfmikes]

I don’t think you understand what a UBI is. It is an amount that is basic income for everybody. The incentive to perform work is to earn income in excess of the UBI. Unlike welfare which (arguably) could provide an incentive not to work since those working lose the benefit, the UBI would not be lost by choosing to work. Again as we progress further technologically there will be no alternative. Even now we are artificially holding back some automation to allow for (relatively) full employment. Downside is many of these unnecessary jobs are lost in instances like a global pandemic and then you have millions unemployed and have to implement a makeshift UBI anyway.

Also the majority of those under 50 do support a UBI when polled. But only 21% of those over retirement age (and thus already eligible for collecting SS) supported it.

Many people will be satisfied with their basic income and will not have incentive. That IS one of the drawbacks

Where are these funds going to come from? The government and the rich.

Discussing the details, pros and cons of UBI is a complicated subject for non-pandemic times, which I’m assuming will be coming soon

However, as far as increasing minimum wage at this time is going to have serious repercussions when unemployment is at an all-time high

 

[hemightbejeremy]

Many people will be satisfied with their basic income and will not have incentive. That IS one of the drawbacks

Where are these funds going to come from? The government and the rich.

There’s plenty of literature you can read on UBI if you are interested. In a nutshell the money comes from the same place it does now. Necessary jobs decrease, but GDP still grows and demand for goods and services is still present. Things like carbon taxes, reworking the existing welfare system, public ownership of technologies, etc have all been floated. Taxes on businesses could increase, but wages they have to pay would decrease...due to the UBI supplement. The exact details are for smart people to figure out, but the current model is not going to be sustainable far into the future. We are already seeing the largest wealth inequality in history and it’s only going to get worse.

 

[DaShuckster]

The weird thing about this minimum wage angst is that the same gloom and doom “small businesses can’t survive” arguments have been raised every single time the minimum wage has been raised in the past.

But THIS time is different, right?

 

[Ucfmikes]

The weird thing about this minimum wage angst is that the same gloom and doom “small businesses can’t survive” arguments have been raised every single time the minimum wage has been raised in the past.
But THIS time is different, right?

Most small businesses are on the cusp? What’s your point?

So.., we have to eliminate every small business and the only stores are Publix and Walmart. Conglomerates and monopolies are so good for consumers. Additionally, every small business owner will be a Walmart slave

Next time you go to the doctors office, don’t ask why you waited 2 hours instead of 1 hour and were seen for 5 minutes. Or why you were treated like a piece of meat because only large multi-provider practices can survive and your friendly neighborhood doc closed down or sold his practice

America is surviving on low income jobs being the workforce supporting businesses and everyone has the opportunity to move on to something else

 

[firm_bizzle]

Hire in what field? Once everyone goes to $15 an hour, you can say bye to half the the fast food chains for starters. Doctors offices will suffer because they will need to cut staff. Many other businesses that rely on low income jobs will suffer and close. Additionally, many other jobs will need to an increase in pay as a domino effect.

Where do you think this money is going to come from?

So you think that someone will make fries for $9 before working the front desk for $15?

 

[hemightbejeremy]

Hire in what field? Once everyone goes to $15 an hour, you can say bye to half the the fast food chains for starters. Doctors offices will suffer because they will need to cut staff. Many other businesses that rely on low income jobs will suffer and close. Additionally, many other jobs will need to an increase in pay as a domino effect.

Where do you think this money is going to come from?

Many fast food chains that you are worried about are international and already exist in places with higher minimum wages.

 

[UCFKnight85]

The weird thing about this minimum wage angst is that the same gloom and doom “small businesses can’t survive” arguments have been raised every single time the minimum wage has been raised in the past.

But THIS time is different, right?

Yes. Economics say so.

 

[Crazyhole]

Many fast food chains that you are worried about are international and already exist in places with higher minimum wages.

Apples and oranges.

 

[chemmie]

Yes. Economics say so.

Only if you pretend the rest of the civilized world, and their policies for wages, taxation, benefits, and *GASP* socialism, doesn't exist.

 

[chemmie]

Apples and oranges.

How so? They wouldn't be making money in those countries if your sophomoric theories were accurate. They would have no profit. It would be pandemonium.

 

[hemightbejeremy]

How so? They wouldn't be making money in those countries if your sophomoric theories were accurate. They would have no profit. It would be pandemonium.

There are fast food places in literally every country in the world. Even those with generous minimum wages. In Australia minimum wage is roughly $15 USD. Their Big Mac costs between 1% and 17% more than it does in the United States.

 

[Crazyhole]

How so? They wouldn't be making money in those countries if your sophomoric theories were accurate. They would have no profit. It would be pandemonium.

Buying power is different in other countries than it is in the US because we are the world's reserve currency. It goes beyond the dollar relative to, say, the euro, because there is an artificial demand for dollars that increases its value in the market.

 

[Ucfmikes]

So you think that someone will make fries for $9 before working the front desk for $15?

Your posts lately don’t make a lot of sense, so I can’t respond.

 

[Ucfmikes]

Many fast food chains that you are worried about are international and already exist in places with higher minimum wages.

Apples and oranges. You can’t compare other countries to the United States

There are 14,000 McDonald’s in the United States and under a thousand in Australia

That’s one Fast Food chain. All of the lesser chains can’t pay it and are not international. They will close. Many already have during the pandemic

 

[Ucfmikes]

After doing research, if passed, minimum wage will go to $10 in September of 2021 (which is fine) and a $1 increase every year until 2026 when it will reach $15 an hour. So.., this whole conversation is kind of moot because I thought the jump would be to $15
right away.

 

[Ucfmikes]

Opponents, like the Florida Restaurant and Lodging Association, say a minimum wage at $15 per hour will have disastrous effects on the state’s tourism industry and will cause employers to find ways to cut staffing, reduce hours for remaining staff and find ways to automate work. They also remind voters of the trickle-down impact as business owners would be forced to pass along costs to consumers.

 

[firm_bizzle]

Your posts lately don’t make a lot of sense, so I can’t respond.

Nobody is working at McD's for $9 when they can work at a Disney hotel for $15. The effect is that everyone will have a floor of about $15.

 

[Ucfmikes]

Nobody is working at McD's for $9 when they can work at a Disney hotel for $15. The effect is that everyone will have a floor of about $15.

And fast food chains will close, cut staff or pass it on to consumers. People are working at fast food chains now for $9 or whatever, because some are low skilled and absolutely cannot work for Disney in almost any capacity. Additionally, there are more fast food jobs available now than at Disney

Raising salaries to $15 will probably not affect Disney too greatly although it will, but will have a more devastating effect on businesses that require low skilled and low paying jobs. Once again though, this isn’t happening overnight

The bottom line is less jobs will be available at $15. If this happened tomorrow, we would immediately furlough employees, so how can that even be argued?

 

[firm_bizzle]

And fast food chains will close, cut staff or pass it on to consumers. People are working at fast food chains now for $9 or whatever, because some are low skilled and absolutely cannot work for Disney in almost any capacity. Additionally, there are more fast food jobs available now than at Disney

Raising salaries to $15 will probably not affect Disney too greatly although it will, but will have a more devastating effect on businesses that require low skilled and low paying jobs. Once again though, this isn’t happening overnight

The bottom line is less jobs will be available at $15. If this happened tomorrow, we would immediately furlough employees, so how can that even be argued?

Not overnight but very soon. All of the major employers in the Orlando area will be at $15 by next fall, the rest of the state will follow (if not lead in South FL). Covid throws all previous business models up in the air, there will mostly likely less jobs at higher pay anyway. This is a 15yo discussion because it's already happening.

 

[Crazyhole]

Pretty interesting if true.

 

[DaShuckster]

Pretty interesting if true.

Qanon is pretty interesting too. If true.

 

[hemightbejeremy]

View embedded media

Pretty interesting if true.

That would be a close lead for NY if true. Not unheard of. Reagan carried NY actually. But recently it’s been rock solid Democrat.

 

[Crazyhole]

That would be a close lead for NY if true. Not unheard of. Reagan carried NY actually. But recently it’s been rock solid Democrat.

I would have guessed 15 points. Its been a while since NY was in play, for sure.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Not overnight but very soon. All of the major employers in the Orlando area will be at $15 by next fall, the rest of the state will follow (if not lead in South FL). Covid throws all previous business models up in the air, there will mostly likely less jobs at higher pay anyway. This is a 15yo discussion because it's already happening.

So if the corporations are already doing this, why do we need a law mandating $15 upon small businesses who do not have hordes of cash and revenue that Target or Disney has? You guys keep advocating for something by force and mandate and then admit that it's already being done by those companies that 1) can actually afford it and 2) need to offer $15 to be competitive.

 

[firm_bizzle]

So if the corporations are already doing this, why do we need a law mandating $15 upon small businesses who do not have hordes of cash and revenue that Target or Disney has? You guys keep advocating for something by force and mandate and then admit that it's already being done by those companies that 1) can actually afford it and 2) need to offer $15 to be competitive.

The people will get to vote this fall on if a law is needed or not. It's the way things should work. Personally I've thought that $15/hour was going to happen regardless. Losing low wage jobs is not a bad thing. These jobs are making it increasingly difficult to live in this state as more low-skilled workers come here. Why work at McD's in Iowa when you can work at McD's in Florida? This has put a huge strain on our infrastructure, environment and schools systems.

 

[UCFKnight85]

The people will get to vote this fall on if a law is needed or not. It's the way things should work. Personally I've thought that $15/hour was going to happen regardless. Losing low wage jobs is not a bad thing. These jobs are making it increasingly difficult to live in this state as more low-skilled workers come here. Why work at McD's in Iowa when you can work at McD's in Florida? This has put a huge strain on our infrastructure, environment and schools systems.

Are you suggesting that order takers at McD's are going to move entire States to be an order taker somewhere else?

 

[firm_bizzle]

Are you suggesting that order takers at McD's are going to move entire States to be an order taker somewhere else?

Yes. Low skilled employees will move entire states to be low skilled employees in warmer states.