Part of is that the receivers need good reps and momentum.
Every receiver getting 1-2 *catchable* targets per half is not enough.
Quick takes from the Georgia Tech game
- Thread starter AuburnLegacy_1
- Start date
Every receiver getting 1-2 *catchable* targets per half is not enough.
Instead of a 2 QB system, what we need to do is to get that "Transmogrifier" that Calvin had and throw both Keene and Plumlee in there together and then they'll merge together forming the ultimate quarterback the likes of which the universe has never seen!
Before Plumlee I was actually looking forward to Keene. I thought for what he was, basically an 18yo High School kid, he played well. I was looking forward to him getting a full off-season with the 1’s and a full camp as the guy, to see if he could get a little bigger and improve overall. Basically, I just thought he lacked power, and he seemed to be addressing this by adding some mass.
After he committed to Plumlee, it became crystal clear Gus would never switch to Keene. MK has thrown his last pass at UCF barring a disaster. Gus will go to TC if anyone. MK just does not fit Gus’ system. TC is the easier switch because Gus can still lean on the QB run game. MK forces Gus to go more traditional. I think MK can scramble but he’s no runner. And behind this O-line I have to believe JRP is better off but then again, defenses will continue to play run until JRP forces them to do otherwise whereas I think MK would likely get different looks.
Hard to say, one vs. the other, but IMO the actual depth chart is JRP-TC-MK.
After he committed to Plumlee, it became crystal clear Gus would never switch to Keene. MK has thrown his last pass at UCF barring a disaster. Gus will go to TC if anyone. MK just does not fit Gus’ system. TC is the easier switch because Gus can still lean on the QB run game. MK forces Gus to go more traditional. I think MK can scramble but he’s no runner. And behind this O-line I have to believe JRP is better off but then again, defenses will continue to play run until JRP forces them to do otherwise whereas I think MK would likely get different looks.
Hard to say, one vs. the other, but IMO the actual depth chart is JRP-TC-MK.
our student section deserves the slander
Despite his throwing motion, Mikey gets the ball out fast, which is what you need when the line doesn't provide lots of time to throw.
Agreed. And furthermore...
4. Jarvis Ware over Thornton and Adams at CB
5. Koby Perry over Wilson at safety.
6&7. Give Collins and Rubelt some reps at the tackles. Grable and Swoboda are ok but at times they look like they need a break.
8. Get MAR some touches at RB even if it's only 3 or 4 per game. He is too valuable to push to the portal.
He made it clear to Gus that he doesn't want to do that...as he wants to keep all 3 of his remaining eligible years at his next team he goes to.
Huh? Are you suggesting Keene tore it up in that game? In fact he did almost nothing outside of the TD pass to O'Keefe.
This is where a message board rumor turns into fact....6 months from now posters will be stating that Mikey refused to play for Gus and no one will bat an eye. Same thing happened with DG.
I
If JRP can only manage 49 yds against GT, does anyone really believe he’s going to suddenly put up even reasonable numbers against SMU, Cincinnati, etc? If he’s only progressed this far after weeks of spring and summer practices, how can we expect any credible improvement during the season when every week he has to prepare for different teams with different defensive schemes? If we continue with the same offensive production we’ll be lucky to go 7-5, 8-4.
Last edited:
Most of those yds are running. Once everyone starts stacking the box his yds running will drop significantly and passing will likely stay the same or drop as we give up more sacks or he continues laser focusing on his primary WRs.
We're 4 games in, it doesn't take that long to adjust. Teams know what JRP is, hell they knew what he is before the season and he's still averaging 101 yards per game on the ground. Just ran for 100 yards in our 4th game.
Imagine if MK had the amount of drops last year that JRP has had this year. He wouldn’t have recorded any stats lol. The drops have been absolutely uncanny, it’s game after game, which makes me wonder if any of you guys are actually watching the game or just the box score.
The drops and the OL collapsing like a house of cards, that’s the bigger issue. Not the play calling or the QB play. We’re extremely lucky to have JRP’s athletic ability or this season would look very very worse.
Do the numbers bear it out? I'd like 0-drops too, but is it really worse than "normal?"
Does one of the pay sites track drops?
He led us to victory over the Gators. You can call that doing nothing if you wish. We lose that game if DG was in.
That is a laughable take. That's straight up not understanding what you're watching when watching a football game.
I do understand that we won against the Gators. I also understand that DG played two games against teams with a pulse in 2021, Boise and Louisville. He panicked and threw pick sizes in both. I also understand that Keene showed no signs of panicking against UF and did not throw a pick in the red zone or at any other critical times. Furthermore, I understand that he did not throw a pick at all during the entire bowl game. Do you understand the importance of taking care of the ball? Maybe you don't understand how easy it is to throw for 350+ yards and lose because you throw one or two more picks than your opponent.
Again, we won against an SEC team with a pulse. I'll take it.
Didn't he play against Boise and Lou? Pick 6 in both and no 30 point victories. Nothing wrong with your being a DG fan. But keep your illusions to yourself.
You do understand that our defense was a lot better at the end of the season than it was at the beginning, right? That’s kind of important fact. The QB can’t control everything.
He led the largest comeback in program history against Boise, the D had given up 35 point points to Louisville before any pick was thrown and that pick wasn’t even his fault, he put on the hands of the receiver and he couldn’t pull it in. That’s football.
I have no allegiance to Gabriel, but I can notice the fact that our offense went in the tubes the moment he got injured and for the most part it’s still there.
He led the largest comeback in program history against Boise, the D had given up 35 point points to Louisville before any pick was thrown and that pick wasn’t even his fault, he put on the hands of the receiver and he couldn’t pull it in. That’s football.
I have no allegiance to Gabriel, but I can notice the fact that our offense went in the tubes the moment he got injured and for the most part it’s still there.
Despite your attempt at deflection, my point was that a.)Keene beat the Gators and b.) DG would not have done so. You cannot deny the first point and your take on the second point is limited to conjecture. We can agree to disagree on what would have happened had DG faced the Gators in the Gasperilla Bowl.
So your point is: Keene beat the Gators, and DG would not have, because you said so. I can always count on a brilliant discussion/debate on this board.
I think we can all agree that Keene was QB when UCF beat the Gators. But to say he beat the Gators? What are we even doing here, is this a real argument about Keene being a better QB than DG or that you would rather have him over DG?!! Y’all have lost your damn minds man I swear!
One guy transferred and is starting at Oklahoma, the other is a backup and will transfer and be a backup somewhere else, probably an FCS school.
It's all hypothetical and all apples-to-oranges but everyone accuses everyone else of being speculation. It's all speculation. We are where we are and DG is gone.
Whoever is responsible, I think the Gasparilla Bowl was perhaps the most mature and complete performance I had seen in a long time. It was hard fought, and our guys stuck it out and didn't break down, on offense or defense. We worked their DL to where we could run the clock out with Bowser. To me it is a complete win when you are able to end the game with a bruising run drive that the other team can't stop. I can't remember when I saw that last in a close game.
Whoever is responsible, I think the Gasparilla Bowl was perhaps the most mature and complete performance I had seen in a long time. It was hard fought, and our guys stuck it out and didn't break down, on offense or defense. We worked their DL to where we could run the clock out with Bowser. To me it is a complete win when you are able to end the game with a bruising run drive that the other team can't stop. I can't remember when I saw that last in a close game.
Brilliance starts with the ability to read and understand what is written. I never said DG wouldn't win "because I said so". Learn to comprehend and refrain from misquotes.
You gave no explanation as to why you thought DG would lose the game when Keene would win. (hence the because I said so)
Comparing players' abilities based upon what jerseys they wear? I will never directly or impliedly shortchange the UCF program or it's players with such a comment. But to tie into your line of thought regarding DG, think about how he got to OK and what that says about his commitment/leadership. Jumping from team to team within a few weeks time. Departing a starting job at UCF because he refused to be part of a team that was developing a strong running attack and also wanted him to develop his touch on short and intermediate routes... That doesn't say much about his being a team player and his willingness to grow his skillset.
Did I say that Keene is better than DG? No, not at all. But I am saying that they both have different strengths and weaknesses. I think that if Keene were allowed to utilize more of the passing playbook, which he was incrementally allowed to do against UF, we would begin to see a player with better touch than DG on short and intermediate routes and also reasonable/effective accuracy on deep throws.
I do believe that DG will always win with larger point totals against lesser teams as he plays very sharp with wide open targets and throwing from clean pockets. However his relative value is greatly decreased when playing under pressure due to his resulting propensity to 3 and outs, missed targets underneath, late reads, missed reads, throws into double coverage and red zone ints and other issues related to an apparent lack of calm under pressure. I feel that Keene has shown more composure under pressure.
This is part of my comparative assessment of these two guys. I understand that you and others may disagree. I just wanted to give a little more of my reasoning. I do feel that both possess strengths that the other is not as good at. I believe the net result is that one (DG) admittedly gives you more explosive plays and higher point totals against lesser teams. Ironically, the other, Keene, provides the potential to win more games, even if in more of a gradual way of moving down the field, and with lesser margins of victory, but with more calm under pressure, and using more clock, with less three and outs and a more efficient red zone attack.
Last edited:
Ok. I accept that. I gave more insight to my position in my response to U C to the F just posted above. For simplicity sake I won't paste it again here. Feel free to review and comment. As a note, I understand that this is possibly all academic as one guy has left and the other may possibly not step on the field for us again. But it might have relevance in the future regarding what attributes do we value most in our play behind center.
I appreciate the more thorough explanation. I just don't really agree with anything you said here. We had an absolute ton of 3 and outs with Keene at QB. I don't have the stats, but I would almost guarantee the percentage of 3 and outs with Keene was much higher than Gabriel's when he was here. All this talk about INTs and composure under pressure, Gabriel has 14 career INTs in 30 games. (0.4667 INTs per game) Keene had 6 INTs in the 11 games he played (0.545 INTs per game) And that's with far far fewer attempts per game than Gabriel, and much lower degree of difficulty with his throws. Gabriel always took crap for not running while he was here. He ended up with 375 yards rushing in his 2+ years with us. Keene had -36 rushing yards last year! How exactly does this equate to Keene having the potential to win more games?
The opening up of the playbook as you put it in the Florida game, led to Keene passing for 90 yards on 21 attempts outside of the 54 yard TD pass to O'Keefe in which he does deserve credit for. If my memory serves me correctly that was the only 10+ yard in the air pass he completed in the game. We won that game because the defense played lights out and Keene handed the ball off to Bowser 35 times and he was a monster. With O'Keefe and Richardson providing explosive plays on the ground as well.
I admitted that DG will provide better stats. In the games in '21, DG goes 2-1 for a 66% win pct.. With Keene we win 7 of 10 for a 70% win pct. including a win over UF. DG never beat a team with the talent level of UF in over two years. Again, he is great against lesser teams, but would wilt when you need a statement win against a better level program. Some are enamored with big stats. I say just win baby and win more often.
MK also made several big 3rd down throws at the end of the UF game…..which resultEd in first downs and kept drives going and the ball away from UF. Geeesh….Give the kid credit for helping us win games.
JRPs QB rating at Ole Miss his freshman year in 9 games 108.4
MKs was significantly higher…as in not even close……133.2
MK was clearly a better QB at the same stage of development…anyone forecasting JRP as a better QB was only doing so on a guess, a hunch, a gut feeling, and a strong distaste for MK….not facts, not the data/statistics derived from watching the game…..and certainly not as a knowledgeable talent evaluator understanding how athletes can develop and improve.
JRP did nothing before arriving at UCF to give anyone with objectivity a reason to believe that he’s a better QB than MK. He was a WR not a QB the last two years…or did some of you make your evaluation on watching him throw the ball back to the referee after catching a pass?
I‘ve watched every game, every throw, and while MK missed throws, JRP has also missed plenty of wide open passes and also thrown interceptions….. not to mention the many dropped interceptions….
Turnovers are the surest way to lose games…..MK minimized turnovers….if JRP doesn’t make better decisions and make better passes…our record will barely be over .500
Having said that, I trust that Gus chose the QB he felt gives us the best chance to win and will make a change if he feels it’s warranted…..I’m not giving up on JRP yet. I don’t see him being completely ineffective…he’s made good passes…just like MK has and can. JRP has the potential to put up good passing stats, but so does MK.
Unlike some unrealistic fans, I don’t freak out over not having our QB throw for 300 yards every game…if he makes good decisions with the ball, minimizes turnovers, and we win…may not be fun to watch or sexy, but I’m good…winning is fun.
A QB rating is objective, not all encompassing, but objective…..But everyone’s entitled to an opinion on who the better QB is…an opinion like…I think red is the better color, better than blue.…I‘m ok with you liking blue …as long as we’re winning. Charge on!
JRPs QB rating at Ole Miss his freshman year in 9 games 108.4
MKs was significantly higher…as in not even close……133.2
MK was clearly a better QB at the same stage of development…anyone forecasting JRP as a better QB was only doing so on a guess, a hunch, a gut feeling, and a strong distaste for MK….not facts, not the data/statistics derived from watching the game…..and certainly not as a knowledgeable talent evaluator understanding how athletes can develop and improve.
JRP did nothing before arriving at UCF to give anyone with objectivity a reason to believe that he’s a better QB than MK. He was a WR not a QB the last two years…or did some of you make your evaluation on watching him throw the ball back to the referee after catching a pass?
I‘ve watched every game, every throw, and while MK missed throws, JRP has also missed plenty of wide open passes and also thrown interceptions….. not to mention the many dropped interceptions….
Turnovers are the surest way to lose games…..MK minimized turnovers….if JRP doesn’t make better decisions and make better passes…our record will barely be over .500
Having said that, I trust that Gus chose the QB he felt gives us the best chance to win and will make a change if he feels it’s warranted…..I’m not giving up on JRP yet. I don’t see him being completely ineffective…he’s made good passes…just like MK has and can. JRP has the potential to put up good passing stats, but so does MK.
Unlike some unrealistic fans, I don’t freak out over not having our QB throw for 300 yards every game…if he makes good decisions with the ball, minimizes turnovers, and we win…may not be fun to watch or sexy, but I’m good…winning is fun.
A QB rating is objective, not all encompassing, but objective…..But everyone’s entitled to an opinion on who the better QB is…an opinion like…I think red is the better color, better than blue.…I‘m ok with you liking blue …as long as we’re winning. Charge on!
QB rating doesn’t take rushing into consideration. Rushing is JRP’s biggest strength. Take that away and yeah he’s going to look bad.
The offense has not been good this year, but it’s definitely been better than last year under Mikey and as we’ve all noted that’s with Bowser clearly not as effective as he was last year when healthy.
At this moment, I’m OK with those who say that MK 2022 probably has a better passing skill set than Plumlee. The problem with MK is he limits the playbook Gus wants to use, no question. Here is the basic passing stats for Plumlee for the 3 games where the opponent had a pulse:
49 completions on 86 attempts (57%), 519 yards, 1 TD, 3 Int and 6 yrds per att
Obviously not good, but this is on the coaching staff for giving him too many plays that are outside his skill set. Having him stand in a static pocket for more than 5-6 attempts per game is dumb. A blitz against a guy with his athleticism should almost never work.
49 completions on 86 attempts (57%), 519 yards, 1 TD, 3 Int and 6 yrds per att
Obviously not good, but this is on the coaching staff for giving him too many plays that are outside his skill set. Having him stand in a static pocket for more than 5-6 attempts per game is dumb. A blitz against a guy with his athleticism should almost never work.
Come playoff time the defenses Lamar Jackson faces have a pulse and he doesn’t play well. He gets sacked against good defenses. You beat a blitz by throwing to spot where blitz came from. Trying to outrun a blitz is hard to do.
Similar threads
