Schiff sued by a doctors association

[Crazyhole]

Let me explain my point in excruciating detail because I guess you can't understand third grade logic or apply third grade logic in context of the on going discussion.

Flat earth conspiracies are hilariously fun. But they immediately require you to take a leap of faith that all stitched satellite imagery and full-earth photos taken from further out are doctored and fake. Their theory has no basis to explain why their proposed earth model doesn't appear that way in photos. Thus a huge leap of faith is required just to get past the most basic evidence - a photo. A reasonable person takes the full earth photos at face value. They may listen to your arguments of conspiracy theories and such, but it's going to take a lot of evidence to overcome Occam's Razor.

In other words, the scientifically uninformed but reasonable lay person will place a high level of confidence in NASA supplied imagery of a "round" earth. That's simple and easy to digest evidence contrary to a flat earth. It requires exactly zero knowledge of 18th century classical physics to arrive at this conclusion.

If a mom on FB is nervous about vaccinating her baby thanks to some anti-vax FB group, there's no "round earth photo" equivalent to counter those arguments.

So yes - my point was simple enough a third grader could understand it - though it doesn't appear you did.

So do you believe that the earth is round solely because of the pictures you've seen? The thought never crossed my mind whether to believe them, but the main reason I dismiss the flat earthers is because I was on a cruise ship and could literally see the curvature of the earth. Personal experience should trump what we are told or shown. we arent that far from people using technology to create photos that are completely fabricated so I could see someone creating a picture that would bring all kinds of things into question, the shape of the earth included.

 

[Boosted87]

So do you believe that the earth is round solely because of the pictures you've seen? The thought never crossed my mind whether to believe them, but the main reason I dismiss the flat earthers is because I was on a cruise ship and could literally see the curvature of the earth. Personal experience should trump what we are told or shown. we arent that far from people using technology to create photos that are completely fabricated so I could see someone creating a picture that would bring all kinds of things into question, the shape of the earth included.

Disagree. Anecdotal experience and half-baked science projects are exactly how flat-earthers stand up their belief. And from everything I've read, you need to be several miles above sea level to measure curvature in a photograph. So I don't know how you could have actually seen curvature on a cruise ship. In any case, a sufficiently large planet would have imperceptible curvature from a sea level view.

Frankly, many flat earthers do the opposite of what you just did - and claim because they can't measure curvature in photographs near sea level, that's proof there's no curvature.

 

[Crazyhole]

Disagree. Anecdotal experience and half-baked science projects are exactly how flat-earthers stand up their belief. And from everything I've read, you need to be several miles above sea level to measure curvature in a photograph. So I don't know how you could have actually seen curvature on a cruise ship. In any case, a sufficiently large planet would have imperceptible curvature from a sea level view.

Frankly, many flat earthers do the opposite of what you just did - and claim because they can't measure curvature in photographs near sea level, that's proof there's no curvature.

If you believe you can't see it from 200 ft up in the middle of the ocean, you've never been there. My whole family was amazed at how clear it was. Low level planes have a great view of it as well.

That isn't anecdotal evidence, its corroborating evidenc . Anecdotal evidence would be suggesting watching a boat go down a river and can still see it 3 miles away and suggesting that as proof that the earth is flat.

 

[UCFBS]

Let me explain my point in excruciating detail because I guess you can't understand third grade logic or apply third grade logic in context of the on going discussion.
Flat earth conspiracies are hilariously fun. But they immediately require you to take a leap of faith that all stitched satellite imagery and full-earth photos taken from further out are doctored and fake.

You mean like all the 'physics' that various moon conspiracy theory videos showcase, and people believe, because they don't remember their 18th century, classical physics?

I.e., it's not that hard to fool someone.

Their theory has no basis to explain why their proposed earth model doesn't appear that way in photos.

Sure they do! Plenty!

If a mom on FB is nervous about vaccinating her baby thanks to some anti-vax FB group, there's no "round earth photo" equivalent to counter those arguments.

Parents are nervous because there are significant (>>1%), not negligible, risks to several vaccines on government required schedule, especially for schools. We've ballooned the number in the past generation! It's not always the 'downs' or 'autism' arguments. Educated, well-informed, parents, who talk to their doctors.

And, if you read the CDC's own 'outbreaks' on measles, none of them are fundamentalist Christian populations. Most Christians get their kids vaccinated. It's other, fundamentalist religions and migratory cultures, where the outbreaks have been.

The 'conspiracy theory' of the religious right anti-vaxxer is getting old. It's an US Media created narrative, supported by social media memes. In reality, the primary issue is elsewhere.

So yes - my point was simple enough a third grader could understand it - though it doesn't appear you did.

Because I expect everyone to have at least a high school graduate level of working knowledge biology, chemistry and physics.

That's why most people are easily fooled -- in both directions -- on climate change. E.g., if people even remembered their basic, high school level physical electrical, they would never partake in anything like Earth Hour.

 

[Boosted87]

Because I expect everyone to have at least a high school graduate level of working knowledge biology, chemistry and physics.
.................
Parents are nervous because there are significant (>>1%), not negligible, risks to several vaccines on government required schedule, especially for schools. We've ballooned the number in the past generation! It's not always the 'downs' or 'autism' arguments. Educated, well-informed, parents, who talk to their doctors.

Look man - you're a smart dude, probably too smart. Your expectations are WAY too high. No one is worried about educated, well informed parents talking to their doctor's about risks. We're worried about uneducated, uninformed parents getting their "science" from anti-vax facebook groups. And intelligence follows a normal distribution. For every educated well informed parent, there's an equally uneducated and equally mis-uninformed parent.

 

[UCFBS]

Look man - you're a smart dude, probably too smart. Your expectations are WAY too high. No one is worried about educated, well informed parents talking to their doctor's about risks.

And yet, in 80% of cases, people throw the aforementioned, in with ...

We're worried about uneducated, uninformed parents getting their "science" from anti-vax facebook groups. And intelligence follows a normal distribution. For every educated well informed parent, there's an equally uneducated and equally mis-uninformed parent.

And yet, I'm an anti-vaxxer ...
And I'm a bigot ...
And I'm anti-freedom ...
And anti-woman's rights ...
Etc...

Just because people talk at a 3rd grader level.

Again, what Christian fundamentalist groups have been hit hard by measles outbreaks according to the CDC?

We have Jewish and Muslim fundamentalists communities, and we've had a pair of migratory refugee communities. But none of the clusters have been Christian fundamentalists ... none.

It's not the primary problem. In fact, I have many very well educated, even Liberal, colleagues that home school and take serious issue with the vaccine schedule many states and the CDC push. And there's good evidence that a lot of natural birth options are better than hospitals, which a few have told me about.

We're talking Democratic voting vegan blocks here. They are not conservatives. They are classic Liberals who don't trust Big Pharma, the government screwed Healthcare and Public School systems, and I don't blame them. Especially since their views are similar to Big Food (aka Food, Inc.) as well.

But ... they're alleged even bigger anti-vaxxers than me. No, they are just very, very well educated.

 

[fried-chicken]

Personal experience should trump what we are told or shown.

Well RIP the advancement of the human race if we start needing to verify all things personally vs trusting the scientific method and the discoveries of our ancestors. Do we need each person on earth to individually test the theory of relativity? That's they whole point of science. To build on the discoveries of previous generations. If something gets discovered that changes things then we make adjustments but we shouldn't need to start from ****ing scratch by seeing a globe earth first hand. Jesus.