Trumps middle east peace plan

[DaShuckster]

The word I should have used from the start was mediation, not negotiation. If one party “walks out,” your attempt at mediating a satisfactory resolution has failed.

That’s been the history in this case and this latest ham-handed attempt by Trump is going to be no different.

 

[Cubs79]

"There were attempts by Trump to hold a phone call with Abbas, but the latter refused,” a high-ranking Palestinian official, who was not named, told Turkey’s Anadolu news agency, adding that the attempted calls took place in the past couple of days.

Channel 12 news on Monday reported that Abbas called Trump “a dog, son of a dog” in a meeting with Fatah officials over the past day. The report did not cite any sources, and the PA denied it, with an official in Abbas’s office saying no formal meeting of Fatah leadership took place on Monday or Sunday."

I can't believe trump didnt even try to include the Palestinians.

Again, talking to someone and including them are not the same thing. All of this you are posting is after the deal had already been worked out, and Palestine had no say in that part of the process, you know, the part that actually matters.

 

[Crazyhole]

Yet they had no say in the actual deal, Trump basically gave them lip service and met with them after the deal had been worked out with Israel, so that isnt inviting them to actually participate in negotiations. This deal would have annexed almost all of the Palestinian settlements in the West Bank, almost of all of East Jerusalem, and given limited sovereignty to Palestine.

That article was from september 2017. Abbas stopped talking to him in december of that year but the US and Israel kept moving forward. He also tried calling Abbas a week before they released the plan.

 

[Cubs79]

That article was from september 2017. Abbas stopped talking to him in december of that year but the US and Israel kept moving forward. He also tried calling Abbas a week before they released the plan.

Well I wouldnt know where that article is from because you refuse to ever post a link. Regardless, a one sided negotiation is not a negotiation, it is a demand.

 

[Crazyhole]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/articles/president-trump-meets-mahmoud-abbas-palestinian-authority/

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/mark...as-trump-meeting-is-abbas-optimism-justified/

https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas...-pa-urges-arabs-to-boycott-peace-plan-launch/

 

[Crazyhole]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/articles/president-trump-meets-mahmoud-abbas-palestinian-authority/

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/mark...as-trump-meeting-is-abbas-optimism-justified/

https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas...-pa-urges-arabs-to-boycott-peace-plan-launch/

Now that you have the links, are you willing to admit that you're wrong?

 

[Cubs79]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/articles/president-trump-meets-mahmoud-abbas-palestinian-authority/

https://www.brookings.edu/blog/mark...as-trump-meeting-is-abbas-optimism-justified/

https://www.timesofisrael.com/abbas...-pa-urges-arabs-to-boycott-peace-plan-launch/

Ok, this was 2 and a half years ago, and they actually did speak with Trump quite often, which kind of goes against your narrative that they were unwilling to meet at all. A lot can change in 2 and a half years, and in this case, the deal was highly favorable to Israel and Palestine got basically next to nothing.

 

[Crazyhole]

Ok, this was 2 and a half years ago, and they actually did speak with Trump quite often, which kind of goes against your narrative that they were unwilling to meet at all. A lot can change in 2 and a half years, and in this case, the deal was highly favorable to Israel and Palestine got basically next to nothing.

MY narrative??????? You guys are saying that trump didnt even try to include the Palestinians. I said the Palestinians walked away and that trump was still trying to communicate with them. That isnt a narrative, its fact.

 

[DaShuckster]

I said the Palestinians walked away and that trump was still trying to communicate with them.

Apparently it didn’t stop Jared from give his father-in-law an 80-page plan that Trump heralded as the most amazing peace plan ever.

Yet I’m scratching my head wondering how it’s going to be The Greatest Thing Ever when they couldn’t even keep one side at the table for crying out loud.

Wouldn’t you think that would be a clue it was DOA? But again, this was never about actually DOING anything. It was about giving two corrupt politicians a good sound bite.

 

[Sir Galahad]

THey didnt invite them to participate.

Or should they, until one party came up with the original proposal. Now the world can see the offer, including the Palestinian people.

 

[Cubs79]

Or should they, until one party came up with the original proposal. Now the world can see the offer, including the Palestinian people.

Yes, the offer which is 100% in favor of Israel and gives Palestine basically nothing.

 

[Crazyhole]

Yes, the offer which is 100% in favor of Israel and gives Palestine basically nothing.

Knowing full well that you won't answer, but my question to you is what does a legitimate plan look like?

The Palestinians starting point is full control of the west bank, expulsion of any jews in the region, full control over Jerusalem, and no restrictions on militarization. Where should they negotiate down from?

 

[Cubs79]

Knowing full well that you won't answer, but my question to you is what does a legitimate plan look like?

The Palestinians starting point is full control of the west bank, expulsion of any jews in the region, full control over Jerusalem, and no restrictions on militarization. Where should they negotiate down from?

You dont know "full well" anything about me.

Look, it is a complicated situation for sure, nobody is denying that, but everything you stated has a potential to be negotiated down. What this plan does is gives Israel control over even more Palestinian settlements, over the vast majority of East Jerusalem, control of the borders and air space. This doesnt make Palestine a sovereign nation. So for starters, I think any deal would at least have to do that. Not to mention, Israel only agreed to a 4 year land freeze, so 4 years from now based on this plan, they could could go back and start taking even more land. If Palestine doesnt have full sovereignty, then can you really call it an independent state? The answer is no, you cant.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51299145

 

[Crazyhole]

You dont know "full well" anything about me.

Look, it is a complicated situation for sure, nobody is denying that, but everything you stated has a potential to be negotiated down. What this plan does is gives Israel control over even more Palestinian settlements, over the vast majority of East Jerusalem, control of the borders and air space. This doesnt make Palestine a sovereign nation. So for starters, I think any deal would at least have to do that. Not to mention, Israel only agreed to a 4 year land freeze, so 4 years from now based on this plan, they could could go back and start taking even more land. If Palestine doesnt have full sovereignty, then can you really call it an independent state? The answer is no, you cant.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51299145

4 years for Palestine to create a working government. If they fail to do so, then things go back to normal. In the meantime, they get a permanent capital and 50 billion dollars to build their own functioning government and economic development. Israel is going to foot the bill for direct access between Gaza and the West Bank and provide direct routes for international travel.

Face it, 70 years of terrorism has significantly diminished the legitimacy of Palestine being a sovereign state. Israel is giving concessions that give palestine a pathway to do so, but not at the cost of risking military or terrorist attacks on them. What should more should they give up to make this a fair deal?

 

[Sir Galahad]

Yes, the offer which is 100% in favor of Israel and gives Palestine basically nothing.

Are you Palestinian? Do you live their live?

 

[UCFKnight85]

You dont know "full well" anything about me.

Look, it is a complicated situation for sure, nobody is denying that, but everything you stated has a potential to be negotiated down. What this plan does is gives Israel control over even more Palestinian settlements, over the vast majority of East Jerusalem, control of the borders and air space. This doesnt make Palestine a sovereign nation. So for starters, I think any deal would at least have to do that. Not to mention, Israel only agreed to a 4 year land freeze, so 4 years from now based on this plan, they could could go back and start taking even more land. If Palestine doesnt have full sovereignty, then can you really call it an independent state? The answer is no, you cant.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51299145

Do you know why Israel wants to maintain some level of control and access to and from east Jerusalem? Because the Palestinians have been running terrorists through access points there for 40 years and have attacked Jewish and Christian holy sites.

 

[Sir Galahad]

You dont know "full well" anything about me.

Look, it is a complicated situation for sure, nobody is denying that, but everything you stated has a potential to be negotiated down. What this plan does is gives Israel control over even more Palestinian settlements, over the vast majority of East Jerusalem, control of the borders and air space. This doesnt make Palestine a sovereign nation. So for starters, I think any deal would at least have to do that. Not to mention, Israel only agreed to a 4 year land freeze, so 4 years from now based on this plan, they could could go back and start taking even more land. If Palestine doesnt have full sovereignty, then can you really call it an independent state? The answer is no, you cant.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51299145

Apparently you don’t understand who has control today.

 

[Sir Galahad]

You dont know "full well" anything about me.

Look, it is a complicated situation for sure, nobody is denying that, but everything you stated has a potential to be negotiated down. What this plan does is gives Israel control over even more Palestinian settlements, over the vast majority of East Jerusalem, control of the borders and air space. This doesnt make Palestine a sovereign nation. So for starters, I think any deal would at least have to do that. Not to mention, Israel only agreed to a 4 year land freeze, so 4 years from now based on this plan, they could could go back and start taking even more land. If Palestine doesnt have full sovereignty, then can you really call it an independent state? The answer is no, you cant.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-51299145

Apparently you don’t understand who has control today.

 

[UCFWayne]

MY narrative??????? You guys are saying that trump didnt even try to include the Palestinians. I said the Palestinians walked away and that trump was still trying to communicate with them. That isnt a narrative, its fact.

im so surprised that shook cant make a statement about how he feels on anything until after trump does something.*

cubs continues to go out of his way to make trump and israel look bad even though there are some pretty good links with time stamps involved.

 

[DaShuckster]

im so surprised that shook cant make a statement about how he feels on anything until after trump does something.*

Yeah, if Trump had gotten the two sides together and successfully mediated a peace agreement between them, I would have proclaimed that one-sided, 80-page plans with maps was the real way to go!!!

 

[Crazyhole]

Yeah, if Trump had gotten the two sides together and successfully mediated a peace agreement between them, I would have proclaimed that one-sided, 80-page plans with maps was the real way to go!!!

What would you have done?

 

[UCFWayne]

Yeah, if Trump had gotten the two sides together and successfully mediated a peace agreement between them, I would have proclaimed that one-sided, 80-page plans with maps was the real way to go!!!

i guess you missed those links crazy posted showing that he was working with them until they walked out. then trump continued to work on a plan, got other local nations to sign off on it, and then present it for the world to see.

trump is terrible.*

 

[Crazyhole]

i guess you missed those links crazy posted showing that he was working with them until they walked out. then trump continued to work on a plan, got other local nations to sign off on it, and then present it for the world to see.

trump is terrible.*

It's truly amazing, isn't it? Literally nothing trump has done as president is ok to some people and they instinctually go on the offense against him without even considering any facts whatsoever. At the very best, they will admit that something is good but it's in spite of him, not because of him. And then those same people complain about how he is responsible for dividing the country. SMH.

 

[UCFKnight85]

The fact that Israel is still even willing to sit down and offer what they did to the Palestinians is testament to how willing and eager THEY are to finally reach a peace accord.

This is a country that took a shitty peace deal during the British Mandate but took it anyways simply to have its' own State; they were then promptly attacked by Palestinian Arabs and 6-7 Arab nations, not once, not twice, but 3 times in an effort to eradicate the only Jewish State in the world. All because Israel dared to have a tiny sliver of land of their own amongst the entire region run by Arabs and Muslims, after most all Jews in those countries were forced to leave.

Despite being attacked and winning 3 wars, they still conceded ground back to the very Arabs who attacked them in the name of peace. Egypt still has a country largely because Israel backed off to manage a lasting peace.

In 1987 Israel unveiled a sweeping peace proposal where they again made significant concessions; in return the PLO issued the 1st Intifada and rained terrorism down on Israel for 5 years. Follow by another Intifada. And another.

And yet somehow it's just poor meanie Trump, the US, and Israel not making the effort to strike a peace deal. Yep, it's all our fault that these poor lil Palestinians and their Hamas leaders don't have a thriving nation of their own by now!

 

[DaShuckster]

And yet somehow it's just poor meanie Trump, the US, and Israel not making the effort to strike a peace deal!

You people are so far up Trump’s ass your knee jerk response to any criticism is “well, geez, he TRIED!”

The issue is that Trump declared his 80-page plan (with maps) was the Greatest One Ever when any rational, thinking observer knew the peace agreement was literally Dead On Arrival.

What’s up with that?!? One might get the impression this was more about a crass distraction from the impeachment trial than any attempt at meaningful diplomacy in the Middle East.

 

[NinjaKnight]

Didn't bother reading this, I honestly don't know who is dumber, these inbred trump supporters or people who think they can change the mind of someone so mind boggling stupid they are still supporting Trump in Jan of 2020.

FYI Jared Kushner, who is "in charge" of the middle east peace plan, couldn't even pass a run of the mill background check for a basic security clearance.

 

[Crazyhole]

You people are so far up Trump’s ass your knee jerk response to any criticism is “well, geez, he TRIED!”

The issue is that Trump declared his 80-page plan (with maps) was the Greatest One Ever when any rational, thinking observer knew the peace agreement was literally Dead On Arrival.

What’s up with that?!? One might get the impression this was more about a crass distraction from the impeachment trial than any attempt at meaningful diplomacy in the Middle East.

Do you really want to go down the road of who has knee-jerk reactions?

This offer is the culmination of 40 years of palestine running terrorist cells and turning down or walking away from any deal that required them to stop that practice. They've lost almost all support from the Arab nations while Israel has improved theirs, so now they find themselves behind the 8-ball. Even at that rate, they have an offer to become a legitimate nation-state. This should be viewed as their last chance, and by refusing it out of hand shows that they have never been interested in anything other than the extermination of Israel.

 

[UCFKnight85]

You people are so far up Trump’s ass your knee jerk response to any criticism is “well, geez, he TRIED!”

The issue is that Trump declared his 80-page plan (with maps) was the Greatest One Ever when any rational, thinking observer knew the peace agreement was literally Dead On Arrival.

What’s up with that?!? One might get the impression this was more about a crass distraction from the impeachment trial than any attempt at meaningful diplomacy in the Middle East.

Ah yes, typical Shookster reply. Ignore all of the commentary and basis for my comment, cherry pick the last comment, and then respond only to that.

In a way that satisfies your uncurbable desire to bitch and cry about the President.

 

[DaShuckster]

Ah yes, typical Shookster reply. Ignore all of the commentary and basis for my comment...

LOL. This thread started with fawning over a ‘dead on arrival’ proposal and when I called you Trumpsters out on it, what did I get? I got either “it’s Palestine’s fault!” or “At least Trump tried!”

Sorry I didn’t give your lame excuses the attention you thought they deserved.