Don't you know that Trump trying to steal power is an example of a leftist power grab? It makes perfect sense if you don't bother thinking about it
1/6 inquistion
- Thread starter Crazyhole
- Start date
Actually, every US President since Clinton has had major power grabs. Trump is just yet another I've taken issue with. Obama as well. And Biden is a total dickwad to the 10th power now. Clinton-W. really set the standard, and kids today just accept it, even want the President to seize power ... when they agree with them.
But on Clinton, remember ...
They literally had to forbid the White House from even having access to FBI and OPM files because of the Clinton Administration, which is why the Trump Administration very much was 100% ignorant that Domestic Abuse came up in OPM background investigations on one staffer. The lack of any access by law was the reason, because of the Clinton administration.
Clinton also passed EOs in '98 and '99 that W. used immediately after 9/11. If you wonder where much of Patriot comes from, it was those Clinton EOs, which Congress then made law. W. then expanded them, as did Obama, Trump and, now, Biden. We're literally at the point we have a 'Ministry of Truth' codified too.
Heck, even Trump wouldn't have been 1/4th as successful in his 'Stop the Steal' messaging if the Progressive Media wouldn't have spent not only 2016 staying Russia gave Trump the election, but some were already saying Trump was 'stealing' the election the last 3 months before November, 'rigging it against' Biden. Then it suddenly became supporting 'States' Rights' by the left.
I'm so tired of the hypocrisy ... every adminsitration makes it worse. Wake the **** up people! Stop looking to a single branch of government to solve all problems! Take power away from them, not more! Even the Judicial system is trying to get you to WTF too. The US CDC doesn't get to endlessly mandate without expert input.
The reason half the country doesn’t care about this is because they watched the Russia investigation that found nothing chargeable, the two impeachments that were necessary because of the threat to democracy, and then a summer full of riots that killed people, injured thousands of police officers, destroyed federal and state government property with very little repercussion and even outright support from the same people running the inquisition into the one right side riot that didn’t actually kill anyone except for one rioter. IOW, you cry wolf enough and people stop listening to you.
Impeachments are partisan events, they didnt succeed because Republicans werent going to allow them to succeed. Never in the history of this country has something like 1/6 happened. If people dont care they need to ask themselves why they are so beholden to this guy, it is strange to say the least, and also dangerous. The former oath keeper today said to quit mincing words and call it what was, which was an armed rebellion, and that we should be worried about 2024 as well. And this is a guy who was an oath keeper who worked directly with Stuart Rhodes, he isnt a random guy off the street.
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You are the king of whataboutism. Nobody in this country has ever done something like January 6th, except Trump. You trying to compare it to all of these other people is nonsense. There are no valid comparisons.
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This Trumpster quote is PRICELESS coming on the heels of today's damning testimony.
It reminds me of Trump's campaign boast that he could murder somebody on 5th Avenue and he wouldn't lose any of his willfully ignorant Chud voters.
Yeah…that’s not why you are ignoring it.
I hate the idea of Trump running in 2024, so I don't care what happens at the dog and pony show. It's a farce. There's no penalty for the "investigators" lying and they're not even trying to validate their witness testimony so there's no penalty for witness dishonesty either. No adversarial challenging of anyone's statements in any of these hearings at all. Not much of a "fact-finding" exercise at all.
Especially when you consider that, no matter what those people did at the Capitol building that day, they would not have taken over the government and handed the Presidency to Donald Trump. There was never one iota of a threat of that happening whatsoever. They could still be holding the Capitol Building today and Joe Biden would be President today. A 6th grade social studies student could've written a better plan to overtake the Government and yet you and your media and the Democrat party wants us to believe that the people who understood the most of how our Government works actually directed that effort that no only was doomed to fail but never actually targeted anything that even remotely might have by any stretch of the imagination stopped the transition of power.
What investigators have lied? They have shown texts and/or testimony of everything. I dont know exactly what you mean by adversarial challenge, but a number of people have ignored subpoenas, so that is kind of their own fault. I am sure Trump himself could testify if he wanted to, but if he wont, then how is that the committees fault?
I am assuming you mean representation or cross examining, but one, this isnt a trial. But also to add, lawyers have been present for most of the testimonies, so they do have representation. And two, if they ignore subpoenas then explain to me how that is the committees fault? If this is how it works then no one should ever cooperate at all and then just say it wasnt a fair process.
Heeeeeellllooooo....lying under oath to Congress is a crime.
Says a yahoo bashing the hearings without ever watching a second of it.
For your information, the "fact-finding" is eye-witness accounts of what happened coming from Trump's inner circle of diehard Republican advisors for crying out loud!!!
In other words, Trump plans were Coo-Coo Cocoa Puffs from the very beginning. Looks like you're starting to get the picture.
Bingo! You've basically paraphased what WH Council Pat Cipollone said in his taped testimony in yesterday's hearing.
So is the FBI ... unless one has a 'get out of jail free card.'
I personally love the recent defense that 'The FBI knew they were partisan.'
Frankly ... I want them all prosecuted.
But ... establishment gonna establish ... even Trump after he became the establishment.
Exactly. The purpose of congressional investigations isn’t to score political points. It’s to inform the legislative process. Tell me what legislative purpose this political show is serving.
There are various reasons for congressional hearings. Just say you dont like it because it makes Trump look bad, we all know that is why some of you are objecting to it.
I don't care that Trump looks bad, I don't want him to run. That said this is a dog and pony show. You don't put on witnesses who are simply spouting hearsay evidence. There is a reason it isn't allowed in a court.
It isn't hearsay evidence. The vast majority of the evidence is first hand accounts and even text messages.
He’s referring to the one statement made by one of the witnesses that the chud media went crazy over. Keep in mind these people haven’t watched a second of the hearings, but one witness speaking of an incident where she was told something and didn’t see it has luckily invalidated everything fro the hearings they haven’t watched. At least in their mind.
It’s not a dog and pony show. It’s been established that this isn’t a court of law. Understand the nature of these things.
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I know. That was like 2 minutes of a two hour testimony. I do like that the people saying they arent even paying attention to it, are the same people telling us what is going on with the hearings.
EXACTLY! What I'm hearing from our Trump sheep here is the same bullsh*t they're being fed by their right wing Masters in the media.
The very notion that you've got posters questioning why the House is looking into the matter is mindboggling to me. Funny how the same posters who demanded accountability for the Benghazi incident ... now question why we need to investigate a riot in the U.S. Capitol during a joint session of Congress for the Electorial College vote.
A lot of people are tired of both the establishment and Trump.
The GOP really wants to shift Libertarian, and people like Trump have joined the Christian Right to preventing that from happening. That's why several have 'checked out' from the GOP, like Ryan, and I don't blame them.
Rand Paul used Trump to get what he wanted, and then crossed him after the 2020 election, publicly rebuking him, especially in mid-December.
Have you ever considered that perhaps you have this backwards. That it hasn't been politics driving investigations of Trump, but that it's politics that have insulated him from accountability? Just because the Republican Party has made a *political* decision never to hold Trump accountable - does not mean the investigations or evidence against him are any less real. It's just further proof that Trump was right when he made the statement about shooting someone in the middle of 5th Avenue.
POTUS refuses to accept election loss. His White House lawyers tell him what he's trying to do is illegal. Tries to do it anyway. Pressures state officials to find extra votes. Organizes fraudulent electors to be sent to congress. Knowingly directs an armed mob at the United States Capitol during the certification of his loss.
But hey that one chick told us some hearsay about one specific event so it's all a dog-and-pony show.
I think you need to understand that logic and facts do not work on those who simply do not care and already have their minds made up. They are all the very things they accuse everyone else of being: sheep.
I'm hardly a Trump supporter, but this is what I tire of ...
This is why I want throw all of them out! I'm tired of the 'Never Trump' establishment doing exactly everything he is allegedly guilty of! That's the main reason why Trump is so popular!
If the establishment didn't do all the things Trump did as well, he would have 1/4th the support ... probably not even that.
Her own lawyer was proven, in a court of law, to have lied to the FBI ... but it was okay, because he was 'knowingly being partisan' and wasn't part of all those the DOJ and FBI officials who lied to their subordinates to lie to the FISA courts ...
About, then, private citizen Trump. That right there! That right there! You need to be upset about that, even if you don't like Trump!
That goes both ways though. No one has been held accountable for the gross violations against Trump, including proven abuses of power and authority, when he was still a private citizen.
This is why I want throw all of them out! I'm tired of the 'Never Trump' establishment doing exactly everything he is allegedly guilty of! That's the main reason why Trump is so popular!
If the establishment didn't do all the things Trump did as well, he would have 1/4th the support ... probably not even that.
Nor Hillary's entire campaign. It's laughable that we're literally making Assange about the Russians, ignoring the facts of Hillary, Podesta and other things released under FOIA, by the State Department, etc...
Her own lawyer was proven, in a court of law, to have lied to the FBI ... but it was okay, because he was 'knowingly being partisan' and wasn't part of all those the DOJ and FBI officials who lied to their subordinates to lie to the FISA courts ...
About, then, private citizen Trump. That right there! That right there! You need to be upset about that, even if you don't like Trump!
Yes! Yes! Because enough Americans are tired of the establishment, both parties, virtually doing that already! They literally pull the trigger on innocent people regularly!
Do you realize that we were a single sycophantic VP from absolute constitutional chaos? Do you recognize that a lame duck POTUS was contemplating a declaration of martial law in late December in an effort to cling to power? Do you realize that the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs was preparing contingency plans on how to resist a coup attempt by POTUS? That his own cabinet members discussed invoking the 25th Amendment?
When the history books are written decades from now, Trump's effort to overturn the election is going to to the subject of countless books, movies, documentaries, and PhD thesis papers.
Of course this will pale in comparison to the real story - that HRC had a lawyer that lied one time in court. So good point about not treating them equally.
No, we weren't. Why? Because civics prevents a single person from doing anything.
No, that's the narrative. Besides, again, civics prevents a single person from doing anything.
And that happens with Biden regularly too. Again ... let it go.
Of course! Just like there has been with Hillary and the 2016 election, as well as all the Democratic Senators that refused to certify the 2016 election results, etc...
The only difference is the protest where a minority (1/3rd) of the attendees decided to approach or even enter the building.
It's not just one thing. Again ... there is an establishment, and that's why Trump is popular. When people like yourself recognize that, and all their illegal activities too, Trump's support base will die down.
Until then, and dismissals by people like yourself ... Trump will remain popular. This is why I cannot stand either!
People like yourself created Trump. Trump is a symptom of the problem. And he won't be the last.
Civics only matter if they are upheld. Our government institutions are made up of people, and people can be corrupt. You have no idea what would have happened had Pence gone along with the plan and to say "civics" would have stopped it is a naive and dangerous road to go down, because you are essentially just putting trust in other people doing the right thing.
There is always going to be an establishment, that is such a dumb point. At this point, Trump is the establishment, certainly of the Republican party. Before him Reaganism was the Republican establishment, and down the road it will be something/someone else. You are just using a buzzword to make your argument, and it makes no sense.
If Pence went up there and said "Due to widespread evidence of fraud during this election, I'm not counting the votes from a certain set of contested states" - what exactly do you think happens? I sure as hell don't know and neither do you, but it is a constitutional crisis and that's exactly what Trump wanted in the moment - chaos.
But that's fine cause UCFBS would just yell "but guys! civics!" and crisis would be averted I guess.
I'm convinced you aren't listening to any of the evidence or testimony at all.
If you think the "only difference" from 2016 was the mob. No - the mob was the culmination of a months long campaign to undermine the outcome of the election lead by Trump. HRC conceded remember?
They are intentionally ignoring it and just trying to make it out to be like any other political scandal. Anyone who has paid attention to these hearings can see it was an attempted coup. We are going to end up in an authoritarian country just to "own the libs" if some of these Republican voters (and yes UCFBS, I know you are a libertarian) dont wake up and acknowledge what Trump is and what he is trying to do.
Obviously you don't know your civics. There is a procedure for this. But it doesn't matter, because ... in the US Constitution ... The Electoral College very much is the end-all, be-all, certified ... or not!
Rand Paul pointed this out to Trump and Democrats, alike. He wasn't the only one. Mike Pence was another. Many Republicans did too.
So ... if you actually knew your civics, you would have realized what you're arguing does not matter. This is why there are people like me who can differentiate civics from ...
... total, ****ing bullshit hyperbole. And that's what this is. It gets old. Don't treat me like a Trumper either. But no, I'm not joining your bullshit at the same time.
This is the difference between knowing civics ... and listening to the raving and hyperbole of US Mass and Social Media, which is designed to keep us ignorant for advertising dollars.
Oh, but I am! I'm totally against Trump. But ... the civics worked! And even if Pence had gone against it ... the civics would still work!
Just like Biden in 2016, where virtually just as many Democrats, as Republicans in 2020, asked Biden not to certify! Biden rejected their argument as well!
So I have Biden in 2016 to thank, just like Pence in 2020, but ... even if neither did ... it still doesn't ****ing matter. So ... take your "But you have to care!" ... and shouve it up your Media Kissing @$$.
You mean how the months long campaign to undermine the outcome should Trump win as well?! How Hillary staffers were involved with it too?
That's the thing ... I see the same bullshit on both sides! I'm tired of both of you!
And the Russia thing ... my Framers ... you're still pushing that bullshit, despite the evidence? Despite the lies? Same with the Hunter denials!
And then went silent, and 'worked the Electoral College.' And then she was still bad mouthing the Electoral College, saying Russia influenced them, even more so her staffers!
Hillary and her supporters helped plant the seed in undermining confidence in Democracy! Without them, Trump has 1/4th the support!
Why don't Democrats and the US Mass and Social Media, along with Big Tech, take ownership of that?! That's what I'm tired of!
It's why I purposely and absolutely refuse to 'stand with you!'
You're the instigators as much as them!
Obviously, you don't know your civics.
Hillary conceded the 2016 election and wished Trump well.Worked the Electoral College??!? What the hell is that supposed to mean?
If you knew your civics, you'd know the Electoral College results are very much the end-all when it comes to choosing our Presidents.
Attempts to overthrow a lawful election don't happen lawfully. Authoritarian strongmen don't say "oh there's a procedure? neverminded I'll go home."
Procedure doesn't write history - it's the actions of individuals. Have you read the Eastman memo? There's consensus out there that his legal arguments are bunk - but they are untested. There is no precedent for the path(s) he was arguing for and no precedent for any response made by Pelosi in the house.
At that point yes - we are relying on institutions and "procedure" to prevent a soft coup. But that's kind of the point isn't it? You're argument is akin to saying "Oh those guys trying to rob the bank? Yea you can ignore the explosives they're setting up cause that vault requires a code so everything is fine!"
Please stop overstating what happened. That's the problem here. Most people are being overly demonized, especially the 2/3rds who never entered the building.
Heck, they even dragged in long retired military officers, who are not even still reservists, into court, by abusing the rule that even officers who have fulfilled their reservist period, post-commission, must still be 'available' for a full decade. They are 100% civilian, and that is an utter abuse of the rule.
E.g., they not only did their 4 years active, but also their required 4 years as reservists, but there they are, over a decade since they were active, are 100% veterans, and not even reservists, having run a small business for 8 years as a civilian -- now obliterated by special interest lockdowns -- being drug into military court ...
Our most productive Americans are pissed for a reason. The government destroyed their livelihoods, not just their freedom, along with people who were employed. You are literally and crossly insensitive.
Yes ... I want Trump held accountable, just like Hillary too. But in the process, we have literally demonized people the government has already destroyed ... people who even served their country too. Stop demonizing them for political gain!
Stop being the sheep 'your team' of politicians want. Stop pissing on the small guy. They've been ****ed enough. Don't condone this sh-- just to get Trump. It's only making him far, far more popular when people are wrongly demonized who just wanted to protest getting ****ed up the @$$ by authoritarian.
That's the thing, 'Authoritarians' aren't just limited to Trump. They are every state and federal office who refused to listen to the courts too! The US CDC has been repeatedly berrated by justices for refusing to follow the required law too.
I'm honestly tired of the American assumption that a federal agency answers to no one, and violates the law ... repeatedly, blatantly. Many of these people were ****ed by it, and the lack of 'following the science' and purposely ignoring it, is how we got here for many of them.
You are utterly insensitive to the whole problem here, just like the Cabal with destroying people's freedoms and livelihoods out of horrendous science, just because.
Authoritarian, self-serving, oligarchy-building strongmen and women are the politicians! The people you are voting for! Stop voting for them! You have the power.
Again, Trump is a symptom of the establishment ... both parties!
And you're ignoring, as an irresponsible voter, all the crooks in Congress.
It wasn't a shocker what happened. The more authoritarian the government gets, the worse it will get. We the voters have the power to change that. But we won't.
The revolution is coming. I wish it wouldn't, but you're so pro-Authoritarian, you are just one of the sheep who argue over 'which authority' to listen to.
That right there is the problem! I want them all gone! I vote responsibly. You 'protect your team.' That's why the left, who has utterly abused their authority too, are no better than the right.
You say 'QAnon' and don't realize ... a lot of people there had nothing to do with QAnon.
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If you are keeping up with these hearings then there is no logical way you can say people were overstating what happened. It was an attempted coup, and it is obvious. I would respond to more but you are all over the place as usual
When exactly did I demonize anyone not named Trump - particularly lawful protestors who didn't set foot inside the Capitol? When did I utter "QAnon" anywhere on this thread? I'm not sure I've even uttered it on this board before.
You seriously do this in everyone of your multi-quote responses to one of my posts. You construct narratives about what you *think* I believe and have said based on your broad stereotyping of who you think I am, and literally make things up.
Do it once or twice and it's a mistake. Do it multiple times every post, and it's a flaw in your ability to track and process a conversation. Honestly, your replies read like every single left-leaning poster on this board has merged in your head into a single entity and that's who you're replying to.
Most of his posts are pointless gibberish where he just wants to play the whataboutism game and not address the actual things people are discussing. He thinks because he types a lot of words with several quote boxes that he is somehow saying something meaningful.
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