Cisgender

[ChrisKnight06]

So maybe I'm late to the party but I actually finally looked this up after reading a comment online from a guy identifying as such. I've heard it used a lot of over the last year but just never looked in to it and its origins etc.

The linked article was one of the first that popped up:

In short, any person who identifies with their sex and gender assigned at birth is cisgender. A cisgender man, for example, is a person assigned male at birth who identifies as a man. That often means a man born with a penis. Meanwhile, a cisgender woman is a person assigned female at birth who identifies as a woman—most are born with a vagina and develop other secondary female sex characteristics in puberty, such as breasts.

Why is this even necessary? What's the point?

“Cisgender” itself took off because the term gives proper contrast between cis and trans experiences, accurately portraying cisgender people without defining cisgender men and women as humanity’s default gender identities. By calling cisgender people “cisgender” instead of using a word like “common” or “normal,” activists and gender theorists could avoid stigmatizing trans people in their work.

That's where it loses me. Are men and women not our default gender identities? That's not to say there arent others and I'm not even suggesting you need to say "normal" identities bc of the connotation but male and female are indisputably most common. That shouldn't even be a controversial statement to make.

Is there a push to make cisgender the appropriate term one must use to not be considered transphobic or whatever?

Is this no big deal or a sign of something larger?

I have no issue with calling people to their face what makes them more comfortable and surely don't go out of my way to be exclusionary but I just found this interesting. The idea of taking something that seems so obvious and without needing explanation and making it in to a seemingly unnecessary thing.

I'm curious if we can have a sensible conversation around this without out it devolving in to the typical thread around here.

https://www.dailydot.com/irl/what-is-cisgender/

 

[cnsaguy]

Lol at 'gender assigned at birth'

 

[Crazyhole]

So maybe I'm late to the party but I actually finally looked this up after reading a comment online from a guy identifying as such. I've heard it used a lot of over the last year but just never looked in to it and its origins etc.

The linked article was one of the first that popped up:

In short, any person who identifies with their sex and gender assigned at birth is cisgender. A cisgender man, for example, is a person assigned male at birth who identifies as a man. That often means a man born with a penis. Meanwhile, a cisgender woman is a person assigned female at birth who identifies as a woman—most are born with a vagina and develop other secondary female sex characteristics in puberty, such as breasts.

Why is this even necessary? What's the point?

“Cisgender” itself took off because the term gives proper contrast between cis and trans experiences, accurately portraying cisgender people without defining cisgender men and women as humanity’s default gender identities. By calling cisgender people “cisgender” instead of using a word like “common” or “normal,” activists and gender theorists could avoid stigmatizing trans people in their work.

That's where it loses me. Are men and women not our default gender identities? That's not to say there arent others and I'm not even suggesting you need to say "normal" identities bc of the connotation but male and female are indisputably most common. That shouldn't even be a controversial statement to make.

Is there a push to make cisgender the appropriate term one must use to not be considered transphobic or whatever?

Is this no big deal or a sign of something larger?

I have no issue with calling people to their face what makes them more comfortable and surely don't go out of my way to be exclusionary but I just found this interesting. The idea of taking something that seems so obvious and without needing explanation and making it in to a seemingly unnecessary thing.

I'm curious if we can have a sensible conversation around this without out it devolving in to the typical thread around here.

https://www.dailydot.com/irl/what-is-cisgender/

I think you touched on it when you used the word "normal". The truth is, of the approximately 20 billion people who have ever existed, 99.99999% have been born with either a penis or a vagina and their DNA would corroborate that. Even if transgenderism is a legitimate thing, it would have to be considered impossibly rare for nature and our DNA to accidentally give us the wrong set of sexual organs. Therefore, "normal" is a very accurate term. Using "Cisgender" simply undermines the idea that there is a normal and an outlier, creating the impression that it is closer to 50-50 than 99.99999 to .00001.

 

[KnighttimeJoe]

Gender is fluid you fukcing ignorant racist boobs.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Lol at 'gender assigned at birth'

Being born with a penis is no longer proof that you're a boy.

 

[btbones]

I’m cisgender

 

[chemmie]

Why is it a hard concept to grasp that human knowledge of gender, genetics, hormones, and sexuality, may not be completely understood yet?
Fact: There are some people born as a male or female who feel completely different psychologically. This is considered "abnormal," but it is only abnormal due to our current level of understanding the subject matter.

A better question: why does anyone give a damn? Who cares? Just be a decent human being and be nice to other people. Don't be an asshole and expect everyone to conform to what you think is "normal."

 

[DaShuckster]

I think you touched on it when you used the word "normal". ... Using "Cisgender" simply undermines the idea that there is a normal and an outlier, creating the impression that it is closer to 50-50 than 99.99999 to .00001.

The opposite of normal is abnormal. You know, deviant.

So when it comes to anything outside of a heterosexual couple expressing heterosexual desires towards one another in a committed monogamous relationship, your "abnormal" percentage skyrockets. Given the stigma that our American society has attached to "abnormal sexuality" over the years, it shouldn't be a shocker to see the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction. I'm not inclined to use the cisgender label myself but I can understand why some people do.

 

[Crazyhole]

The opposite of normal is abnormal. You know, deviant.

So when it comes to anything outside of a heterosexual couple expressing heterosexual desires towards one another in a committed monogamous relationship, your "abnormal" percentage skyrockets. Given the stigma that our American society has attached to "abnormal sexuality" over the years, it shouldn't be a shocker to see the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction. I'm not inclined to use the cisgender label myself but I can understand why some people do.

No, no, this isnt about homosexuality. Its about, as Chemmie put it, whether a person feels that their genitals and DNA match what they mind tells them. A gay man or gay woman don't fall into the same category.

 

[UCFKnight85]

A better question: why does anyone give a damn? Who cares? Just be a decent human being and be nice to other people. Don't be an asshole and expect everyone to conform to what you think is "normal."

Holy God, the amount of hypocrisy oozing out of this last line, from you, is astounding. We need HazMat teams to come clean it up.

 

[Crazyhole]

Why is it a hard concept to grasp that human knowledge of gender, genetics, hormones, and sexuality, may not be completely understood yet?
Fact: There are some people born as a male or female who feel completely different psychologically. This is considered "abnormal," but it is only abnormal due to our current level of understanding the subject matter.

A better question: why does anyone give a damn? Who cares? Just be a decent human being and be nice to other people. Don't be an asshole and expect everyone to conform to what you think is "normal."

It seems that if we are looking at a psychological vs. physiological conflict, more doubt should be raised on the psychological factor. Much less is known about brain function than about DNA at this point.

 

[UCFWayne]

So maybe I'm late to the party but I actually finally looked this up after reading a comment online from a guy identifying as such. I've heard it used a lot of over the last year but just never looked in to it and its origins etc.

The linked article was one of the first that popped up:

In short, any person who identifies with their sex and gender assigned at birth is cisgender. A cisgender man, for example, is a person assigned male at birth who identifies as a man. That often means a man born with a penis. Meanwhile, a cisgender woman is a person assigned female at birth who identifies as a woman—most are born with a vagina and develop other secondary female sex characteristics in puberty, such as breasts.

Why is this even necessary? What's the point?

“Cisgender” itself took off because the term gives proper contrast between cis and trans experiences, accurately portraying cisgender people without defining cisgender men and women as humanity’s default gender identities. By calling cisgender people “cisgender” instead of using a word like “common” or “normal,” activists and gender theorists could avoid stigmatizing trans people in their work.

That's where it loses me. Are men and women not our default gender identities? That's not to say there arent others and I'm not even suggesting you need to say "normal" identities bc of the connotation but male and female are indisputably most common. That shouldn't even be a controversial statement to make.

Is there a push to make cisgender the appropriate term one must use to not be considered transphobic or whatever?

Is this no big deal or a sign of something larger?

I have no issue with calling people to their face what makes them more comfortable and surely don't go out of my way to be exclusionary but I just found this interesting. The idea of taking something that seems so obvious and without needing explanation and making it in to a seemingly unnecessary thing.

I'm curious if we can have a sensible conversation around this without out it devolving in to the typical thread around here.

https://www.dailydot.com/irl/what-is-cisgender/

i had no idea how much of a bigot you truly were.*

 

[btbones]

Why is it a hard concept to grasp that human knowledge of gender, genetics, hormones, and sexuality, may not be completely understood yet?
Fact: There are some people born as a male or female who feel completely different psychologically. This is considered "abnormal," but it is only abnormal due to our current level of understanding the subject matter.

A better question: why does anyone give a damn? Who cares? Just be a decent human being and be nice to other people. Don't be an asshole and expect everyone to conform to what you think is "normal."

He wasn’t bringing it up to be disrespectful or say they aren’t normal . No one is going to assume you are transgender unless you say you are trans imo . So why add confusion with this cis business .

 

[chemmie]

He wasn’t bringing it up to be disrespectful or say they aren’t normal . No one is going to assume you are transgender unless you say you are trans imo . So why add confusion with this cis business .

Shouldn't the end goal be to just be kind to other people?
Because if somebody feels a little better about themselves because they were referred to with a different pronoun, than that is a good thing for everyone.

(and I wasn't specifically talking to Chris. I was making a broad statement about people who get bothered by these things. I don't understand why anyone would be bothered by the pronoun somebody else wishes to be referred to. It doesn't affect you, so don't worry about it.)

 

[btbones]

Shouldn't the end goal be to just be kind to other people?
Because if somebody feels a little better about themselves because they were referred to with a different pronoun, than that is a good thing for everyone.

(and I wasn't specifically talking to Chris. I was making a broad statement about people who get bothered by these things. I don't understand why anyone would be bothered by the pronoun somebody else wishes to be referred to. It doesn't affect you, so don't worry about it.)

I just don’t believe it’s necessary to agree with this to be nice to other people . Personally I don’t care either way but it’s just silly imo . Male = male at birth . That’s obvious . Trans means the person felt as if their birth gender didn’t suit them and made the change .

But yes obviously the goal should always be kindness

 

[bqknight]

It’s no big deal IMO - I know what it means but I would never use it in passing. If someone asked me if I was cisgender, I would say yes but if someone asked what gender I was - I would just say male.

I honestly think it’s a term that is and will be used in in-depth conversations about gender and identity - it’s not a colloquial term.

It’s used in my community more frequently as trans people are more common in friend groups and social circles. For instance, on Grindr - when it asks your gender, it gives cis-male as an option. Here it’s relevant, as the other option is trans male.

 

[Sir Galahad]

Why is it a hard concept to grasp that human knowledge of gender, genetics, hormones, and sexuality, may not be completely understood yet?
Fact: There are some people born as a male or female who feel completely different psychologically. This is considered "abnormal," but it is only abnormal due to our current level of understanding the subject matter.

A better question: why does anyone give a damn? Who cares? Just be a decent human being and be nice to other people. Don't be an asshole and expect everyone to conform to what you think is "normal."

You’re absolutely right, who cares if some dude who is a man wants to act as if they are a female even though nature and science says he is a male.

 

[DaShuckster]

You’re absolutely right, who cares if some dude who is a man wants to act as if they are a female even though nature and science says he is a male.

Apparently some folks don't get the kindness thing.

 

[UCFKnight85]

Apparently some folks don't get the kindness thing.

You labeled someone a racist based upon a lie and refused to admit it and still insist they’re a racist.

You attacked a bunch of conservative kids based upon a lie and refused to admit you were wrong and refuse to even admit that they weren’t doing what you claimed they were.

“Some folks don’t get the kindness thing”

 

[chemmie]

You’re absolutely right, who cares if some dude who is a man wants to act as if they are a female even though nature and science says he is a male.

Your lack of compassion never ceases to amaze.

 

[chemmie]

I just don’t believe it’s necessary to agree with this to be nice to other people . Personally I don’t care either way but it’s just silly imo . Male = male at birth . That’s obvious . Trans means the person felt as if their birth gender didn’t suit them and made the change .

But yes obviously the goal should always be kindness

My wife's profession is counseling children dealing with gender and sexuality issues. I've seen first-hand how awful this is. She has had students commit suicide. The least any of us can do is have a little compassion and empathy.

 

[btbones]

My wife's profession is counseling children dealing with gender and sexuality issues. I've seen first-hand how awful this is. She has had students commit suicide. The least any of us can do is have a little compassion and empathy.

Again what I said doesn’t show a lack of compassion and empathy . If you can show me where anything I’ve said or described in this discussion that’s disrespectful towards anyone I’ll buy you one if the 37 dollar pints of beer you love so much

 

[Husk in butt]

My wife's profession is counseling children dealing with gender and sexuality issues. I've seen first-hand how awful this is. She has had students commit suicide. The least any of us can do is have a little compassion and empathy.

Gender issues? Which 100 genders was the problem?

 

[DaShuckster]

My wife's profession is counseling children dealing with gender and sexuality issues. I've seen first-hand how awful this is. She has had students commit suicide. The least any of us can do is have a little compassion and empathy.

If you can show me where anything I’ve said or described in this discussion that’s disrespectful towards anyone I’ll buy you one if the 37 dollar pints of beer you love so much

Let's rewind. You say you personally don’t care but it’s just plain silly because male equals male at birth. It's obvious, right?

But in the next breath you indicate you're not being disrespectful to transgendered folks. You think they're wacko in the head but, nevertheless, you 'respect' them? How's that work?

 

[fried-chicken]

For something that has never at any time nor ever will impact the lives of any poster who has ever posted on this board, you guys get really serious and mad about if people consider themselves a man or a woman. Why don't you just not worry about it?

 

[Crazyhole]

Who's worried about it? This is just a discussion on the merits of a word

 

[Crazyhole]

This is like if the midget community banded together, became militant, and then decided that there needs to be a term for people who arent midgets. And then, subdivided people of all different heights into categories giving each a different term. It would just be completely unnecessary.

 

[DaShuckster]

This is like if the midget community banded together, became militant, and then decided that there needs to be a term for people who arent midgets. And then, subdivided people of all different heights into categories giving each a different term.

From now on, please refer to me as Height-advantaged, thankyouverymuch.

 

[bqknight]

This is like if the midget community banded together, became militant, and then decided that there needs to be a term for people who arent midgets. And then, subdivided people of all different heights into categories giving each a different term. It would just be completely unnecessary.

In all honesty - do we know that little people (that’s the correct term) don’t have a name for people without dwarfism?

There’s no issue with the term cisgender - like I said I don’t believe it to be a colloquial term but more of a descriptor if discussing gender and getting into the nitty gritty.

 

[Crazyhole]

From now on, please refer to me as Height-advantaged, thankyouverymuch.

Oh, so you consider yourself advantaged over short people. There has to be term ending in -ist that I should accuse you of being right now.

 

[Crazyhole]

We probably need a term for people who don't have down-syndrome while we are at it.

 

[ChrisKnight06]

It starts with empathy and compassion and ends with loss of employment if you don't comply with using someone's preferred pronoun usage.

https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/nov/5/professor-sues-university-transgender-policy/

 

[UCFKnight85]

Let's rewind. You say you personally don’t care but it’s just plain silly because male equals male at birth. It's obvious, right?

But in the next breath you indicate you're not being disrespectful to transgendered folks. You think they're wacko in the head but, nevertheless, you 'respect' them? How's that work?

Hey look Mr Delusional is again accusing someone of saying something that they NEVER did

 

[fried-chicken]

When disabled people talk about those who aren't disabled they don't call them normal people. They say able bodied.

No one wants to call a group of people who aren't like them "normal."

 

[fried-chicken]

This is like if the midget community banded together, became militant, and then decided that there needs to be a term for people who arent midgets. And then, subdivided people of all different heights into categories giving each a different term. It would just be completely unnecessary.

They do have a term for people who aren't little people. They call them "average sized"

 

[Crazyhole]

When disabled people talk about those who aren't disabled they don't call them normal people. They say able bodied.

No one wants to call a group of people who aren't like them "normal."

You would be surprised. Mentally disabled people don't call people without the same disability "able-bodied". I've seen first hand how they joke around about being "not normal" and laugh about it. Then again, they aren't as pretentious as some people. They see it for how ridiculous it is.

 

[Crazyhole]

You would be surprised. Mentally disabled people don't call people without the same disability "able-bodied". I've seen first hand how they joke around about being "not normal" and laugh about it. Then again, they aren't as pretentious as some people. They see it for how ridiculous it is.

My favorite term that the kids used to describe people without disabilities was "jive-turkey".

 

[DaShuckster]

They do have a term for people who aren't little people. They call them "average sized"

Sorry fried, there's nothing "average sized" about me, baby!!!

 

[KnighttimeJoe]

Sorry fried, there's nothing "average sized" about me, baby!!!

Your brain is well below average, for sure.

And save it with the toadie retort, Melvin.

 

[ucfversusbcs]

It’s used in my community more frequently as trans people are more common in friend groups and social circles. For instance, on Grindr - when it asks your gender, it gives cis-male as an option. Here it’s relevant, as the other option is trans male.

When email addresses (and then web addies) were first introduced in the media, without the context it made little sense except that maybe it was random behind the scenes codes that was left on the press.. I doubt anyone's response to that wasn't as polarizing as the term cis.