Which one of the vaccines required by schools protects against a virus that is less deadly than covid for children?
How stupid do you have to be to believe this crap?
- Thread starter Crazyhole
- Start date
We would have had to get the entire world to herd immunity. We'd still have the problem with Delta. What's the new one that is tearing up South America? Lambda? That could become our next Delta.
Yep, SARS-CoV-2 b.1.617.2 (initial Delta variants) already existed by the time even the UK and Israel made mRNA vectors available.
That's why by 2021 January,
so many (even if a minority) predicted SARS-CoV-2 would become endemic like OC43-CoV. Even Time magazine, like the US NIH 7 months earlier, in 2021 February was trying to set the expectation that the mRNA vectors weren't designed to nix the spread at all, just prevent serious disease in the blood, as it was IgG-predominant.
The hope was always that mRNA created IgG antibodies in the blood would allow the rest of the body, like IgA antibodies the upper respiratory tract, to naturally build and provide the best. But now we're finding out it's better to be exposed to SARS-CoV-2 first, and then boost IgG.
It's the sad pro-con of saving lives versus reducing spread, but that's not as uncommon as people think.
The hope was always that mRNA created IgG antibodies in the blood would allow the rest of the body, like IgA antibodies the upper respiratory tract, to naturally build and provide the best. But now we're finding out it's better to be exposed to SARS-CoV-2 first, and then boost IgG.
It's the sad pro-con of saving lives versus reducing spread, but that's not as uncommon as people think.
Nothing spreads like Delta.
Originally SARS-CoV-2 P.1 (Gamma variants) in Brazil pre-dates the Delta variants.
It kills more than SARS-CoV-2 b.1.1.7 (Alpha variants), but doesn't spread as fast as Delta. Allegedly serious illness from Gamma is prevented by the Wuhan-1 synthesized mRNA spike protein vectors almost as much as Alpha.
But yes, SARS-CoV-2 C.37 (Lambda variants) are not stopped by the Wuhan-1 mRNA any more than Delta is not.
In fact, although we originally classified Delta, like Alpha and Beta, that is no longer the case (B.1.617.2, AY.1, AY.2, AY.3) as it's mutated, and given its spread, it's mutating fast. Hence why endemic was always very likely.
mRNA vectors really only save lives, but not the pancea everyone made them out to be.
But yes, SARS-CoV-2 C.37 (Lambda variants) are not stopped by the Wuhan-1 mRNA any more than Delta is not.
In fact, although we originally classified Delta, like Alpha and Beta, that is no longer the case (B.1.617.2, AY.1, AY.2, AY.3) as it's mutated, and given its spread, it's mutating fast. Hence why endemic was always very likely.
mRNA vectors really only save lives, but not the pancea everyone made them out to be.
That doesn't work well for the pro-vax, damn the facts, narrative ... which became so full of bullshit from the get-go. Pro-vax actually deterred people from being mRNA vaccinated, because it was so easy to prove was wrong ... especially among minorities.
When 99 percent of the people dying from covid are vaccinated then you have a valid argument. Until then you no valid argument.
How anyone is under the belief that 99% of those dying, let alone hospitalized, are unvaccinated ... is beyond belief.
It's just like people screaming about kids dying. They are literally assuming or listening to mass media and politicians, instead of the statistics.
"One massive analysis of Delta transmission comes from the UK REACT-1 programme, led by a team at Imperial College London, which tests more than 100,000 UK volunteers every few weeks. The team ran Ct analyses for samples received in May, June and July, when Delta was rapidly replacing other variants to become the dominant driver of COVID-19 in the country. The results suggested that among people testing positive, those who had been vaccinated had a lower viral load on average than did unvaccinated people. Paul Elliott, an epidemiologist at Imperial, says that these results differ from other Ct studies because this study sampled the population at random and included people who tested positive without showing symptoms.
These findings — along with an increase in cases in younger people who have not yet received both jabs — underscore the effectiveness of double vaccination against Delta, Elliott says. “We think it’s really, really important to get as many people double vaccinated, and particularly those younger groups, as soon as possible.”
www.nature.com
These findings — along with an increase in cases in younger people who have not yet received both jabs — underscore the effectiveness of double vaccination against Delta, Elliott says. “We think it’s really, really important to get as many people double vaccinated, and particularly those younger groups, as soon as possible.”
How do vaccinated people spread Delta? What the science says
Emerging data suggest that Delta could spread more readily than other coronavirus variants among people vaccinated against COVID-19. But key questions remain.
www.nature.com
When we get to 100% vaccination rate, will it then be a valid argument? Or then instead of using percentages will we start focusing on raw numbers?
Vaccines Work: 97% Of COVID Deaths, 95% Of Hospitalizations And 94% Of Cases Are Among Unvaccinated Pennsylvanians
Health Details
www.media.pa.gov
Look at the timeframe of that data.Vaccines Work: 97% Of COVID Deaths, 95% Of Hospitalizations And 94% Of Cases Are Among Unvaccinated Pennsylvanians
Health Details
Did you look at the reductions ... and their significance?
I.e., unless we're seeing at least 70%, if not 90%, reductions in viral loads, it doesn't matter. The viral loads rarely differ in any significance, from asymptomatic to hospitalized.
That's been proven over and over and over, and why secondary transmissions do not go down in any significance when people live in fully mRNA vaccinated households -- even before Delta!
It's like saying, "Oh, we were only hit with 3,000 rads instead of 4,000 rads."
Correct. Testing positive without symptoms. Which is what has always been the case, asymptomatic is spreading as much as symptomatic, adults as much as elderly, non-hospitalized as much as hospitalized.
Delta even more so. IgG antibodies in the blood from mRNA vaccination don't do jack like IgA antibodies in the upper respiratory tract from natural immunity.
Increases in testing positive, not viral loads of kids (who are far, far less). Most kids have natural immunity, including IgA antibodies in the upper respiratory tract. That's why they have such a high survival rate and low viral load.
Here's the thing ...— underscore the effectiveness of double vaccination against Delta, Elliott says. “We think it’s really, really important to get as many people double vaccinated, and particularly those younger groups, as soon as possible.”
How do vaccinated people spread Delta? What the science says
Emerging data suggest that Delta could spread more readily than other coronavirus variants among people vaccinated against COVID-19. But key questions remain.
Everyone is testing positive. Everyone is spreading. What does that tell you?!
This is why Israel hasn't made a dent ... not even with Boosters. They are literally admitting this in their own studies.
Yep, lies, damn lies and statistics.
If we want to include the majority of deaths so far ... back when Wuhan-1 and Alpha were most common, and the number of mRNA fully vaccinated people were limited, yeah, it's definitely going to skew it 75-90%.
That's why many of us are tired of the bullshit and lies ... including the ongoing resignations. The experts want out. They want people to be told the truth, and the expectations 're-set.'
But the truth is incompatible with the narratives and politicking. Sadly, more people would have been mRNA vaccinated had the truth been told, instead of the total bullshit. The mRNA vaccines never reduced the spread with any significance, and definitely not with Delta.
The US NIH warned us over a year ago, and only Time magazine pointed that out. They were never designed to reduce the spread, and the hope they would still still allow natural immunity to build once vaccinated has been utterly disproven.
So it's simply the pro-con of less deaths (but still plenty of deaths) with mRNA vaccines against elongating into an endemic, which was likely any way, but going to take longer to get under control because of mRNA vaccines.
We squandered the opportunity to have better vaccines, sterilizing vaccines.
For studies this large the results always lag. It takes time to get results in studies. All you can go by in the present is what the hospitals are reporting.
"
Nevertheless, the three vaccines showed continued robust protection for all adults — greater than 82 percent — against hospitalization, emergency room and urgent-care trips.
“It is really, really great to have 82 percent effectiveness in the time of delta,” four to six months after many people have gotten vaccinated, said Eddie Stenehjem, one of the authors and an infectious-disease physician at Intermountain Healthcare, a health system based in Salt Lake City that participated in the study. “We hope this is reassurance to the general public.”
They should have cut off all statistics except the last 3 months. That's the problem. They are including old statistics to make the numbers look better.
Even people recently mRNA vaccinated, ergo ...
Yep, up to 80% is far more accurate.
In fact, there is no data or other proof that deaths increase over time since full mRNA vector vaccination. One set of mRNA shots seems to be enough to provide years of protection against serious disease or death in 60-80% of cases.
Which is why we're seeing the resignations at the US FDA over pushing Boosters, especially no changes in the spike, without data.
The Booster is largely being pushed by 0 tolerance nations that still isolate over positive tests in the hope that Boosters will stop infection. There's no proof that they do, at all. Even Israeli is admitting this, and they are not a 0 tolerance nation ... but they are being ignored.
Boosters are really only for people who don't have strong immune responses and don't build up a lot of IgG anti-bodies -- not everyone.
When we actually get an updated spike protein than the same, 18+ month old Wuhan-1, then maybe Boosters will work. Until then, all the torrent of criticism thrown at Pfizer's CEO for pushing Boosters in 2021 July using no change in formula is warranted. mRNA was supposed to be updated, that was its original promise ... not 1'n done.
So I'm tired of the bullshit. This is more bullshit. I want the truth admitted, the truth backed by the actual, recent data over the past 3 months. Not a report that largely bases it's results on mostly deaths during the first 4 months of mRNA vector vaccines being available, which comprise of 75%+ in this report.
It tells me two things. Where a N95 mask in public and that 97-99 percent of those dying are unvaccinated.Did you look at the reductions ... and their significance?
I.e., unless we're seeing at least 70%, if not 90%, reductions in viral loads, it doesn't matter. The viral loads rarely differ in any significance, from asymptomatic to hospitalized.
That's been proven over and over and over, and why secondary transmissions do not go down in any significance when people live in fully mRNA vaccinated households -- even before Delta!
It's like saying, "Oh, we were only hit with 3,000 rads instead of 4,000 rads."
Correct. Testing positive without symptoms. Which is what has always been the case, asymptomatic is spreading as much as symptomatic, adults as much as elderly, non-hospitalized as much as hospitalized.
Delta even more so. IgG antibodies in the blood from mRNA vaccination don't do jack like IgA antibodies in the upper respiratory tract from natural immunity.
Increases in testing positive, not viral loads of kids (who are far, far less). Most kids have natural immunity, including IgA antibodies in the upper respiratory tract. That's why they have such a high survival rate and low viral load.
Here's the thing ...
Everyone is testing positive. Everyone is spreading. What does that tell you?!
This is why Israel hasn't made a dent ... not even with Boosters. They are literally admitting this in their own studies.
Summary
What is already known about this topic?The incidence of SARS-CoV-2 infection, hospitalization, and death is higher in unvaccinated than vaccinated persons, and the incidence rate ratios are related to vaccine effectiveness.
What is added by this report?
Across 13 U.S. jurisdictions, incidence rate ratios for hospitalization and death changed relatively little after the SARS-CoV-2 B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant reached predominance, suggesting high, continued vaccine effectiveness against severe COVID-19. Case IRRs decreased, suggesting reduced vaccine effectiveness for prevention of SARS-CoV-2 infections.
What are the implications for public health practice?
Getting vaccinated protects against severe illness from COVID-19, including the Delta variant. Monitoring COVID-19 incidence by vaccination status might provide early signals of potential changes in vaccine effectiveness that can be confirmed through robust controlled studies.
Monitoring Incidence of COVID-19 Cases...
After the COVID-19 B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant reached predominance, fully vaccinated people had less risk of infection, hospitalization, and death.
www.cdc.gov
I wear P100. The N95 isn't much better than a cloth mask. It doesn't stop oils.
When the majority of those statistics were people who could not get vaccinated at all! Stop using statistics of people who could not get vaccinated at the time as proof of anti-vaxxers!
As far as the US CDC ... try the US NIH. The US CDC is very slow. The US NIH is the the up-to-date stuff.
E.g., the US CDC, even US FDA, just says Ivermectin is off-label. The US NIH started publishing all the studies showcasing how it works for not just treatment, but preventivem since late 2021 March.
As of June, it's recommended by the US NIH, even though it's US FDA off-label ... which is just like almost everything used. BTW, Ivermectin is used off-label for HIV/AIDS too.
These guys are still brainwashed with this 99.5% pandemic of the unvaccinated? I thought even MSM has finally moved past that. Guess not
The entire narrative is falling apart right before our eyes, yet we continue to go all in on a leaky 1st gen vaccine. This is going to do serious long term damage to public trust once the house of cards collapses. They are already talking about "Plan B" in the UK and a 4th booster in Israel.
Yes, the leaky 1st gen vaccines are doing *some* good, but at what cost? 200K Americans dead from vaccine. Millions others injured. Delta variant hardly drifted at all from wild and vaxes already struggling badly. What gonna happen once drift really starts? (i.e ADE)
I'll add that the raw data is COOKED. As hospitals submit everything covid to get more $$$. There are numerous whistleblowers out there now saying this.
Administrative Fraud: CDC Now Lists Vaccinated Deaths as 'Unvaccinated' - 21st Century Wire
Mercola.com | CDC caught lying by basing supposed 'COVID deaths' on highly misleading statistics.
Here's a thought: maybe it's a case of which COVID statistics we're talking about.
Some really important ones --- like the number of unvaxxed COVID deaths in this country compared to fully-vaccinated COVID deaths --- never seem to get mentioned by UCFBS and his freedumb fighters. Weird, huh?
antivaxxer
noun [ C ]
informal (also anti-vaxxer, anti vaxxer)
US
/ˌæn.t̬i.ˈvæks.ɚ/ UK
/ˌæn.tiˈvæks.ər/
someone who does not agreewith vaccinating people (= giving them injections to preventdisease) and spreads and encourages opinions against vaccines:
Until recently there hasn't been that much US data to discuss on that front, which is why we talk about Israel and the UK. We are now tracking about the same course as both of those countries did, so it was obviously good information to go off of.
And what's the deal with using the term "freedumb" lately? That should rub everybody the wrong way, but some of you guys embrace it.
We also see very strong protection against serious COVID-19 disease in the 12-60yr group, with or without boosters, and for the >60yr group, the protection seems clearly stronger with boosters.
All of these data are consistent, suggesting the vaccines continue to provide strong protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or COVID-19 death.
For the older >60yr group, we see substantial protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or COVID-19 death from vaccination even with boosters (~70%), but this protection appears to have waned from the earlier reported numbers of >90%. However, a substantial proportion of this age group has already received boosters, and these have restored protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or death to very high levels (~93-96%) demonstrating a 4-fold to 6-fold reduction of risk of severe disease, critical disease, or COVID-19 deaths. Even though little time has passed since the booster program started, this provide support for their use in the older adult age group, especially at this time when the current Delta surge leads to high risk of exposure for this vulnerable population.
For the younger 12yr-60yr age group, we see vaccination provides a very high level of protection (~90%) vs. severe disease, critical disease, or COVID-19 death, whether boosted or not. These data do not provide any support for the benefit of boosters in these age groups, but given the low proportion boosted so far and the potential of a remaining Simpson's effect attenuating the estimated booster effectiveness numbers in this analysis , it is possible that as more time passes later data could reveal boosters provide a further reduction of risk.
Data and Details of Calculation:
I downloaded the data for this post from the Israeli MoH dashboard on September 9, 2021. The datasets I downloaded include:
What do new Israeli data say about effect of vaccines & boosters vs. death/critical/severe disease?
Key Points:1. I downloaded and analyzed data containing daily COVID-19 deaths and critical infection numbers from the Israeli ministry of health dashboard from August 10 and September 8, overall and split out by <60yr and >60yr, to assess effectiveness of boosters and vaccination without...
www.covid-datascience.com
I wish we could have percentages on the number of deaths vaccinated vs unvaccinated.
We also see very strong protection against serious COVID-19 disease in the 12-60yr group, with or without boosters, and for the >60yr group, the protection seems clearly stronger with boosters.
All of these data are consistent, suggesting the vaccines continue to provide strong protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or COVID-19 death.
For the older >60yr group, we see substantial protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or COVID-19 death from vaccination even with boosters (~70%), but this protection appears to have waned from the earlier reported numbers of >90%. However, a substantial proportion of this age group has already received boosters, and these have restored protection vs. severe disease, critical disease or death to very high levels (~93-96%) demonstrating a 4-fold to 6-fold reduction of risk of severe disease, critical disease, or COVID-19 deaths. Even though little time has passed since the booster program started, this provide support for their use in the older adult age group, especially at this time when the current Delta surge leads to high risk of exposure for this vulnerable population.
For the younger 12yr-60yr age group, we see vaccination provides a very high level of protection (~90%) vs. severe disease, critical disease, or COVID-19 death, whether boosted or not. These data do not provide any support for the benefit of boosters in these age groups, but given the low proportion boosted so far and the potential of a remaining Simpson's effect attenuating the estimated booster effectiveness numbers in this analysis , it is possible that as more time passes later data could reveal boosters provide a further reduction of risk.
Data and Details of Calculation:
I downloaded the data for this post from the Israeli MoH dashboard on September 9, 2021. The datasets I downloaded include:
What do new Israeli data say about effect of vaccines & boosters vs. death/critical/severe disease?
Key Points:1. I downloaded and analyzed data containing daily COVID-19 deaths and critical infection numbers from the Israeli ministry of health dashboard from August 10 and September 8, overall and split out by <60yr and >60yr, to assess effectiveness of boosters and vaccination without...
1. Why? Are you an expert? Would it change your position on anything?
2. If you bothered to read, you'd know that those numbers have been shared on this board.
Nobody cares what you have say. You’re a loser and a waste of time. You already proven that your field has nothing to do with immunology or virology. You continue to post stupid Twitter articles 24/7. Let some other people with a little bit of intelligence make their points without your obsession with the WC and constant need for attention
I dont have to do anything for attention because I know that you are already obsessed with me. That's why you always respond.
It's funny how when California bypasses the federal government, it's praised.
But when Florida does it, it's wrong.
The sad thing is ... we should track natural immunity! It actually stops the spread!
But nope ... we'll censor it.
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