Vigilante Justice on Trial in Georgia

[sk8knight]

So you're basically saying a jury can't be unbiased so we need to do away with these trials by peers. Correct? I might be ok with having professionals decide guilt. Not Joe the barber deciding if I'm guilty.

You should not be ok with a government official being the sole arbiter of criminal guilt. Anyone can choose a bench trial. A jury of your peers, meaning other citizens of whom the state and the defense have an equal opportunity to pick, is one of the fundamental hedges on government overreach.

 

[DaShuckster]

Hilarious. This is a case involving a white defendant and the 3 people shot by said white defendant were also white. One of which was an actual racist per witness testimony.

Yet here you are, pre-empting the jury decision by insisting that "systemic racism" is going to be the real winner here, or something. Just hilarious.

Just as hilarious as posting in the wrong thread about the wrong trial.

 

[DaShuckster]

So you're basically saying a jury can't be unbiased so we need to do away with these trials by peers. Correct? I might be ok with having professionals decide guilt. Not Joe the barber deciding if I'm guilty.

WTF? I've made a number of statements about jury trials in this thread, but 'doing away' with them sure as hell hasn't been one of them.

A jury of your peers, meaning other citizens of whom the state and the defense have an equal opportunity to pick, is one of the fundamental hedges on government overreach.

But it should go without saying that a 'jury of my peers' reflects my community. Hopefully this Arbury jury will do the right thing. But as I pointed out, a race-heavy (nearly all-White) jury for White defendants in the murder of a Black jogger like this one raises concern. In my humble opinion, this is putting A WHOLE LOT OF FAITH that we live in a color-blind society.

Once-upon-a-time a nearly all-Black jury (in the OJ trial) found the Black defendant innocent of murdering his White wife when most folks around the country who followed the trial were incredulous at the verdict given the evidence. Hopefully, this trial proves America has become a more color-blind society 17 years later.

 

[DaShuckster]

Unfortunately, Mrs Shuckster had the news on this afternoon and I overheard some of the testimony in the Arbury murder trial. The defense was questioning one of the defendants (Bubba Junior) about the sequence of events that fateful afternoon.

The thing that struck me was that you'd have thought the guy on the stand was a police officer. The jury is supposed to believe that chasing a "person of interest" around the neighborhood with guns was the most natural thing in the world under the circumstances. Bubba Jr. testified that the reason they got REALLY SUSPICIOUS of this Black jogger and became convinced he was 'up to no good' was...(drumroll)...because HE REFUSED TO STOP RUNNING when they pulled up beside him in their pick-up trucks and ordered him to. I mean, goodness gracious, what self-respecting Black jogger wouldn't obey when a bunch of White men wearing Seed caps pull up beside him driving pick-up trucks with guns?

I swear to God, Bubba Junior said this statement in the courtroom with a straight face. There's no doubt in my mind that given the Old South culture he clearly grew up in, he thought this is what you do when a Black man comes into your neighborhood.

 

[Knight In TN]

WTF? I've made a number of statements about jury trials in this thread, but 'doing away' with them sure as hell hasn't been one of them.

But it should go without saying that a 'jury of my peers' reflects my community. Hopefully this Arbury jury will do the right thing. But as I pointed out, a race-heavy (nearly all-White) jury for White defendants in the murder of a Black jogger like this one raises concern. In my humble opinion, this is putting A WHOLE LOT OF FAITH that we live in a color-blind society.

Once-upon-a-time a nearly all-Black jury (in the OJ trial) found the Black defendant innocent of murdering his White wife when most folks around the country who followed the trial were incredulous at the verdict given the evidence. Hopefully, this trial proves America has become a more color-blind society 17 years later.

Your absolutely racist posts proves that we’ve become LESS color blind over the past 17 years.

You’re completely fixated on the race of the jurors, and before anything else you’re convinced that it will make a difference.

 

[DaShuckster]

You’re completely fixated on the race of the jurors, and before anything else you’re convinced that it will make a difference.

This is a murder trial of three White vigilantes who chased down a Black man jogging through their neighborhood and charged with murdering him.

Frankly, for some strange reason, I find a jury of 11 Whites and 1 Black person in this particular trial in a Georgia county with a Black population of 55% to be a bit...odd.

Guess that observation makes me fixated on race, huh?

 

[Knight In TN]

This is a murder trial of three White vigilantes who chased down a Black man jogging through their neighborhood and charged with murdering him.

Frankly, for some strange reason, I find a jury of 11 Whites and 1 Black person in this particular trial in a Georgia county with a Black population of 55% to be a bit...odd.

Guess that observation makes me fixated on race, huh?

Those whites can’t be trusted, can they?

 

[DaShuckster]

Those whites can’t be trusted, can they?

We'll see. It's about as close to an open-and-shut case as it gets.

 

[_glaciers]

We'll see. It's about as close to an open-and-shut case as it gets.

you sound like a typical white pussy.

 

[sk8knight]

Well if he is saying you can't get a fair jury?

That’s the purpose of jury selection. Of course, with the external pressures being placed on jurors by activists, the media, and politicians, it’s very possible that jurors cannot be fair in these high profile trials. But the answer is in Managing the external pressures and prosecuting those that are crossing the line. But the system is set up so that we, the people are the judges of each other and not the government. The answer is not to hand power over to government because we, the people have forgotten our responsibilities.

 

[DaShuckster]

That’s the purpose of jury selection. Of course, with the external pressures being placed on jurors by activists, the media, and politicians, it’s very possible that jurors cannot be fair in these high profile trials. But the answer is in Managing the external pressures ...

Given this response, one would think we were asking for the very same thing.

Isn't the best way to "manage the external pressures" is by selecting a jury that reflects the community? Isn't that the most thoughtful and reasonable approach for avoiding the pressures you warn us of coming from 'activists,' 'the media', and 'politicians?' Shouldn't we expect the same diversity of thoughts and experiences that can be found within the community reflected in a jury trial?

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

Given this response, one would think we were asking for the very same thing.

Isn't the best way to "manage the external pressures" is by selecting a jury that reflects the community? Isn't that the most thoughtful and reasonable approach for avoiding the pressures you warn us of coming from 'activists,' 'the media', and 'politicians?' Shouldn't we expect the same diversity of thoughts and experiences that can be found within the community reflected in a jury trial?

There you go trying to use logic with the RED HATS!

 

[Knight In TN]

Given this response, one would think we were asking for the very same thing.

Isn't the best way to "manage the external pressures" is by selecting a jury that reflects the community? Isn't that the most thoughtful and reasonable approach for avoiding the pressures you warn us of coming from 'activists,' 'the media', and 'politicians?' Shouldn't we expect the same diversity of thoughts and experiences that can be found within the community reflected in a jury trial?

To what extreme do you take that?

It sounds like you’re advocating for something like racial quotas in jury selection. For a community that’s 55% black, something close to a 55% black jury would be required?

Is that an accurate representation of your position?

 

[Crazyhole]

To what extreme do you take that?

It sounds like you’re advocating for something like racial quotas in jury selection. For a community that’s 55% black, something close to a 55% black jury would be required?

Is that an accurate representation of your position?

Shuck has replaced blind justice with social justice. Laws mean different things to people based on their skin color and life experiences.

 

[DaShuckster]

To what extreme do you take that?

It sounds like you’re advocating for something like racial quotas in jury selection. For a community that’s 55% black, something close to a 55% black jury would be required?

Is that an accurate representation of your position?

Hello, Earth to Knight In TN: the jury in this case is 11 Whites and 1 Black. I've never been good with Math but is that ANYWHERE in the realm of 'reflecting the community'???

Are you telling me you're okay with that? Is that an accurate representation of your position?

 

[Knight In TN]

Hello, Earth to Knight In TN: the jury in this case is 11 Whites and 1 Black. I've never been good with Math but is that ANYWHERE in the realm of 'reflecting the community'???

Are you telling me you're okay with that? Is that an accurate representation of your position?

I honestly DGAF about the race of the jury. I care about the facts of the case being weighed against the law and the correct determination of guilt or innocence being handed down.

But I’m not a racist. I believe that black people and white people are both equally capable of administering justice correctly. Why don’t you?

 

[DaShuckster]

I honestly DGAF about the race of the jury.

When a jury is racially-skewed the way this one is, you should GAF.

I believe that black people and white people are both equally capable of administering justice correctly. Why don’t you?

I believe in our justice system. But I'm aware of how it can be manipulated.

I'm curious, were you cool with the OJ Simpson verdict? Was justice served?

 

[Cubs79]

I honestly DGAF about the race of the jury. I care about the facts of the case being weighed against the law and the correct determination of guilt or innocence being handed down.

But I’m not a racist. I believe that black people and white people are both equally capable of administering justice correctly. Why don’t you?

You might not care about the race of the jury but you most certainly know the defense does.

 

[Knight In TN]

You might not care about the race of the jury but you most certainly know the defense does.

How do we know that?

 

[Cubs79]

How do we know that?

If they didnt then jury selection wouldnt be such a big issue with any trial. If what you are saying is true, then we could literally just draw jurors names out of a hat, but instead attorneys are allowed to have some control over who the jurors are for.

 

[Knight In TN]

When a jury is racially-skewed the way this one is, you should GAF.

I believe in our justice system. But I'm aware of how it can be manipulated.

I'm curious, were you cool with the OJ Simpson verdict? Was justice served?

Say what you mean, racist. There are too many whites on that jury.

 

[DaShuckster]

Say what you mean, racist. There are too many whites on that jury.

LMAO. We have three vigilante Good Ole Boys charged with killing a 'suspicious' Black man jogging through their neighborhood. 55% of the residents in that county are Black but the jury is...11 Whites and 1 Black??!?

You can call that observation racist. I say it smacks of Good Ole Boy Southern Justice, I pray to God I'm proven wrong.

 

[Knight In TN]

If they didnt then jury selection wouldnt be such a big issue with any trial. If what you are saying is true, then we could literally just draw jurors names out of a hat, but instead attorneys are allowed to have some control over who the jurors are for.

You do realize they don’t just pick jurors based on appearance, don’t you?

Have you ever been part of a jury?

LMAO. We have three vigilante Good Ole Boys charged with killing a 'suspicious' Black man jogging through their neighborhood. 55% of the residents in that county are Black but the jury is...11 Whites and 1 Black??!?

You can call that observation racist. I say it smacks of Good Ole Boy Southern Justice, I pray to God I'm proven wrong.

How many black potential jurors showed up for jury selection and were dismissed?

Were they dismissed because of racism, or did they indicate they already had opinions about the case?

 

[Cubs79]

You do realize they don’t just pick jurors based on appearance, don’t you?

Have you ever been part of a jury?

How many black potential jurors showed up for jury selection and were dismissed?

Were they dismissed because of racism, or did they indicate they already had opinions about the case?

They dont come out and say they are or arent picking them based on appearance, but it is pretty naive to think that doesnt factor in to some cases.

 

[Cubs79]

You do realize they don’t just pick jurors based on appearance, don’t you?

Have you ever been part of a jury?

How many black potential jurors showed up for jury selection and were dismissed?

Were they dismissed because of racism, or did they indicate they already had opinions about the case?

I dont know the # but was several at least, and it was noted from the outset, the judge even commented on it.

 

[DaShuckster]

How many black potential jurors showed up for jury selection and were dismissed?

My understanding is that there were 11 in the original pool. 10 were dismissed and 1 made it.

Were they dismissed because of racism, or did they indicate they already had opinions about the case?

You'd have to ask the defense lawyers. For some reason they were able to successfully dismiss 10 of the 11 in the pool.

 

[Crazyhole]

My understanding is that there were 11 in the original pool. 10 were dismissed and 1 made it.

You'd have to ask the defense lawyers. For some reason they were able to successfully dismiss 10 of the 11 in the pool.

What makes you assume that it was only the defense that dismissed all of those black jurors? Is it because you're sure that the prosecution would want them because the color of their skin would guarantee a conviction?

 

[DaShuckster]

What makes you assume that it was only the defense that dismissed all of those black jurors?

Because that's what was reported.

 

[Crazyhole]

LMAO. We have three vigilante Good Ole Boys charged with killing a 'suspicious' Black man jogging through their neighborhood. 55% of the residents in that county are Black but the jury is...11 Whites and 1 Black??!?

You can call that observation racist. I say it smacks of Good Ole Boy Southern Justice, I pray to God I'm proven wrong.

According to CNN, 26% of that county is black. Where did you come up with 55%?

 

[DaShuckster]

According to CNN, 26% of that county is black. Where did you come up with 55%?

The incident occurred outside the town of Brunswick, the county seat. Depending on the source you use, it's anywhere from 55% to 60% Black.

 

[Crazyhole]

The incident occurred outside the town of Brunswick, the county seat. Depending on the source you use, it's anywhere from 55% to 60% Black.

In Glynn County, where the trial is taking place, more than 26% of the 85,000 residents are Black, and about 69% are White, according to 2019 data from the US Census Bureau.

Judge says 'there appears to be intentional discrimination' in Arbery jury selection, but allows trial to move forward with 1 Black juror | CNN

After a long and contentious jury selection process in a coastal Georgia county in preparation for the trial for Ahmaud Arbery's killing, a panel of 12 people was chosen Wednesday -- consisting of one Black member and 11 White members.

www.cnn.com

 

[DaShuckster]

In Glynn County, where the trial is taking place,

Your county stats are correct. The trial is taking place in Brunswick, which is the county seat and adjacent to where the incident took place.

Any way you want to slice or dice it, a jury selection process that allows the defense to successfully challenge ten of the eleven Black jury candidates is suspect.

 

[Crazyhole]

Your county stats are correct. The trial is taking place in Brunswick, which is the county seat and adjacent to where the incident took place.

Any way you want to slice or dice it, a jury selection process that allows the defense to successfully challenge ten of the eleven Black jury candidates is suspect.

Well you are the one saying the the racial makeup of the jury should mirror the racial makeup of the populace. If the crime was committed outside of Brunswick, and the vast majority of the black population is in Brunswick, then the racial makeup is probably a pretty good representation of the population.

 

[DaShuckster]

Well you are the one saying the the racial makeup of the jury should mirror the racial makeup of the populace. If the crime was committed outside of Brunswick, and the vast majority of the black population is in Brunswick, then the racial makeup is probably a pretty good representation of the population.

LOL

 

[Knight In TN]

Your county stats are correct. The trial is taking place in Brunswick, which is the county seat and adjacent to where the incident took place.

Any way you want to slice or dice it, a jury selection process that allows the defense to successfully challenge ten of the eleven Black jury candidates is suspect.

You realize that when a county sends out jury summons they go out to residents of the county… they don’t limit it to the county seat.

So your 55% number is INTENTIONALLY misleading.

WHY a juror is dismissed is important.

If the defense asks a black potential juror if they have already made up their mind about his client’s guilt or innocence and they say they have, you seem to think it’s racist to dismiss them.

I’ve been part of jury selection before. There were people who were very open about their feelings about guilt/innocence before hearing anything more than the charges read by the judge. It’s not racism to dismiss those jurors.

 

[Crazyhole]

You realize that when a county sends out jury summons they go out to residents of the county… they don’t limit it to the county seat.

So your 55% number is INTENTIONALLY misleading.

WHY a juror is dismissed is important.

If the defense asks a black potential juror if they have already made up their mind about his client’s guilt or innocence and they say they have, you seem to think it’s racist to dismiss them.

I’ve been part of jury selection before. There were people who were very open about their feelings about guilt/innocence before hearing anything more than the charges read by the judge. It’s not racism to dismiss those jurors.

Maybe not intentionally. He probably heard it on MSNBC.

 

[DaShuckster]

It’s not racism to dismiss those jurors.

We shall see.

 

[Crazyhole]

Lol. Sit down and shut up you fools.

 

[Crazyhole]

We shall see.

You were saying?

 

[Crazyhole]

She really is the worst.