when Derek Chauvin inevitably walks ...

[sk8knight]

Which charge was intentional murder? Anyhow maybe the jury was convinced that it was Chauvin’s actions that killed Floyd and each of the statutes sounded reasonable. I personally thought 3rd degree and manslaughter were the two most appropriate but not gonna whine about the 2nd degree conviction. I think it can be argued Chauvin acted both recklessly and maliciously after the the pulse was taken.

Second degree required a predicate felony. The state never laid that predicate felony out. They did confuse the jury by replacing untrained restraint with unlawful restraint. In fact, and highlighted in defense testimony, the prone knee restraint was in the MPD procedures manual at the time of the incident. But Blackwell must’ve called it unlawful at least 20 times in the close. If the jury would’ve asked a question about that felony, then I would’ve said that’s a big reason why they convicted on 2nd degree.

But the jury deliberated for enough time to choose a foreman, eat lunch, and sign the paperwork. So I’m guessing they never even talked about it.

 

[Ucfmikes]

"We the jury have found him guilty of intending to kill the victim"

Also:

"We the jury have found him guilty of not intending to kill the victim, but his actions killed him"



Justice is served.

Can’t see how you can be convicted of both. Makes no sense the way that you put it

 

[Crazyhole]

Can’t see how you can be convicted of both. Makes no sense the way that you put it

Doesn't that make it pretty obvious that this ruling was a CYA type of deal?

Murder 2 and manslaughter 2? Sure
Murder 3 and manslaughter 2? Iffy
All three together? Hard stop. Nope.

 

[sk8knight]

Can’t see how you can be convicted of both. Makes no sense the way that you put it

The nuance isn’t quite right. The 3rd degree requires that you intentionally create a situation that is highly likely to kill someone. Up until the Mohammed Noor trial, this was used for DUI homicide. But they were so intent on getting Noor that they set a precedent that it can then be directed at a single person. That decision is in appeals, which means that it should not have been allowed in this trial but Cahill allowed it so they argued that Chauvin’s neck or upper back restraint set up a general threat of death to someone. Aside from the fact that it’s been used thousands upon thousands of times and is in procedure books around the world as a non-lethal restraint, the prosecution got it in. And then, aside from the experts on both sides admitting there was no airway obstruction and no complete vascular construction, the jury somehow decided that restraint was a general environment for death.

Or they didn’t even bother to care about the law.

 

[DaShuckster]

"We the jury have found him guilty of intending to kill the victim"

Also:

"We the jury have found him guilty of not intending to kill the victim, but his actions killed him"

Justice is served.

This would be much more compelling if you knew what the hell you were talking about.

 

[Crazyhole]

This would be much more compelling if you knew what the hell you were talking about.

Not to you, if we are being honest. You'd support any guilty verdict against Chauvin no matter what. I don't think I'm going out on a limb to say that you would have been pleased if it was a first degree murder charge.

 

[sk8knight]

The funny thing is the prosecution initially charged third degree because there was no intent and no one would say doing the job of a police officer is a predicate felony so third is what they had. Then they dropped the third and added second because they realized that this was directed at someone and not a general threat. They got the third asses back late because of the Noor ruling but left the second because it was late in the process and why the hell not. And the jury convicted on both.

 

[DaShuckster]

Or they didn’t even bother to care about the law.

sk8's boy got convicted on all counts so the jury "didn't even bother to care about the law"

During the closing arguments, I learned that the position that Floyd was kept in while being restrained was illegal. I heard that normal police procedure is to only have a person in that position in order to secure handcuffs behind the person's back but then move him onto his side.

In this case, not only was Floyd down on the street on his stomach with officers on top of him (long after his handcuffs were on) but he was forcibly kept in that position for over nine minutes with Floyd yelling that he couldn't breathe.

But after hearing this testimony -- and after watching the video -- you opine that it's the jury who is ignoring the evidence??!? Really?

 

[Crazyhole]

sk8's boy got convicted on all counts so the jury "didn't even bother to care about the law"

During the closing arguments, I learned that the position that Floyd was kept in while being restrained was illegal. I heard that normal police procedure is to only have a person in that position in order to secure handcuffs behind the person's back but then move him onto his side.

In this case, not only was Floyd down on the street on his stomach with officers on top of him (long after his handcuffs were on) but he was forcibly kept in that position for over nine minutes with Floyd yelling that he couldn't breathe.

But after hearing this testimony -- and after watching the video -- you opine that it's the jury who is ignoring the evidence??!? Really?

The restraint he was using wasn't banned until months later. Ex post facto.

 

[fsucb400]

The restraint he was using wasn't banned until months later. Ex post facto.

Was there anything in the training handbook about continuing to restrain a man who died from the restraint you applied, for an additional 4 minutes?

 

[sk8knight]

Was there anything in the training handbook about continuing to restrain a man who died from the restraint you applied, for an additional 4 minutes?

In the testimony we found out that EMS was close by and there was an expectation that they’d only be there for a minute or so. So it could be reasonable to hold and wait for the professional medics to arrive. Also, that 4 minutes is in debate because the ME that actually performed the autopsy testified that Floyd died at the hospital. And, contrary to the prosecution’s claims, I’ve seen analysis of all of the body cams shows that the “three minutes after there was no pulse” was not supported in that no one actually said there was no pulse to Chauvin so he likely didn’t know. I haven’t listened through all of that myself though but the guy that analyzed it is pretty accurate. Regardless, the jury did what the jury did so y’all should be good and happy.

 

[Crazyhole]

Was there anything in the training handbook about continuing to restrain a man who died from the restraint you applied, for an additional 4 minutes?

If he was dead, who the hell cares what Chauvin did to his body for 4 more minutes? Can't assault a dead person.

 

[DaShuckster]

Regardless, the jury did what the jury did so y’all should be good and happy.

And YOU are not??!? I find that really hard to fathom without raising the R word.

Why you are so hellbent on supporting a bad cop to the bitter end? Christ, celebrate the fact that the jury's decision makes your wife safer on the job and be done with it.

 

[_glaciers]

What are you outraged here about? Was that not Chauvin who kept kneeling on Floyd’s neck for several minutes after being told he had no pulse? Was it somebody else that made damn sure that Floyd was going die during that encounter? Did the jury watch the wrong video?

not very outraged. Luckily, George Floyd is still dead which means another woman-abusing drug addict off the streets. Feel bad Chauvin is paying the price for doing a hero's job though. My life is still the same.

 

[Crazyhole]

not very outraged. Luckily, George Floyd is still dead which means another woman-abusing drug addict off the streets. Feel bad Chauvin is paying the price for doing a hero's job though. My life is still the same.

Well a cop in Ohio shot a black woman that was attacking someone with a butchers knife. Within 2 hours there were protests that involved the chant "say her name".

It's probably time that white police just stop patrolling black neighborhoods or responding to calls in those areas. They aren't wanted, they aren't needed, and when they show up all we get out of it is another AutoZone or Wendy's set on fire.

Cops don't need to be drug into situations that people can work out themselves in whatever manner they see fit.

 

[fsucb400]

not very outraged. Luckily, George Floyd is still dead which means another woman-abusing drug addict off the streets. Feel bad Chauvin is paying the price for doing a hero's job though. My life is still the same.

You sound like the type of guy who celebrates James Earl Ray Day as opposed to Martin Luther King Day

 

[_glaciers]

You sound like the type of guy who celebrates James Earl Ray Day as opposed to Martin Luther King Day

you sound like the type of guy who has had to say "my wife's son Tyreek told me no more internet when he's trying to play Fortnite" and refers to his clapped out Mercury Milan as a luxury vehicle.

 

[goodknightfl]

I feel for everyone involved. Hopefully this helps keep down the violence. We want happy rioters stealing TV's, burning down buildings and hurting innocent people with a smile on their face and not angry ones.

 

[Ucfmikes]

I’m a little uncomfortable with all the gloating as celebrating by politicians, sports personalities, etc. It’s the correct verdict IMO, but very little will change from this.

 

[DaShuckster]

I’m a little uncomfortable with all the gloating as celebrating by politicians, sports personalities, etc. It’s the correct verdict IMO, but very little will change from this.

Maybe I haven't seen what you've seen, but I haven't seen a bunch of gloating. Most responses I've seen were expressions of relief that justice was served.

I did watch a God-awful statement from the Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi that was captured on a Twitter video and posted here. But I wouldn't characterize that as gloating, just a cringe-worthy expression of 'thanks' to George Floyd for apparently dying for justice.

 

[sk8knight]

It appears that at least one juror was tainted and didn't answer his questionnaire truthfully.

Chauvin Juror Admits Participating In Pre-Trial Protest, Photographed In 'Knee Off Our Necks' T-Shirt

Juror No. 52, Brandon Mitchell, answered 'no' to two questions in the juror questionnaire that asked about participation in demonstrations.

legalinsurrection.com

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

I feel for everyone involved. Hopefully this helps keep down the violence. We want happy rioters stealing TV's, burning down buildings and hurting innocent people with a smile on their face and not angry ones.

like thishttps://media1.s-nbcnews.com/j/news...aa09f36a219784ca0ee80fedc013a40.fit-1240w.jpg

 

[Knight_Classes_begin_7pm]

I feel for everyone involved. Hopefully this helps keep down the violence. We want happy rioters stealing TV's, burning down buildings and hurting innocent people with a smile on their face and not angry ones.

and this

 

[DaShuckster]

It appears that at least one juror was tainted and didn't answer his questionnaire truthfully.

 

[Crazyhole]

Well, we have a juror that lied during selection about having a bias on at least 2 questions. The appeal that was filed today made a lot of important points that the appeals court is going to have a hard time denying. I'd say it's probably pretty likely this is going to be overturned and we will have a bench trial.

 

[OLearyLastCall]

Well, we have a juror that lied during selection about having a bias on at least 2 questions. The appeal that was filed today made a lot of important points that the appeals court is going to have a hard time denying. I'd say it's probably pretty likely this is going to be overturned and we will have a bench trial.

Cope.