Mueller Report Has Been Filed UPDATE: 10 cases of obstruction of justice referred to Congress.
- Thread starter fried-chicken
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See, this is fake news. He wasn't charged for anything having only to do with getting a BJ; he was charged because he was actively soliciting Lewinsky and others to lie on his behalf, as it related to the active, ongoing Paula Jones lawsuit against him. Lewinsky was put on Jones' witness list for their sexual harassment lawsuit and the charges were that Clinton was tampering with witnesses as it relates to the lawsuit.
You have things really factually incorrect here.
But there was still no underlying crime, which is the point I was responding to. You cant have this both ways. You cant say it is impossible for Trump to obstruct if there was no underlying crime, but Clinton did obstruct despite their being no underlying crime. You are trying to have this both ways.
ANd he was charged for lying about his relationship with Monica. That is not factually incorrect.
And for the record, I have no problem with Bill being charged with obstruction, because he obviously was trying to obstruct. It doesn't change the fact, there was no underlying crime.
Really? Clinton paid Paula Jones nearly $1M to settle her lawsuit. That doesn't sound like a situation where no crime was committed to me.
He was also cited by a US District Judge for repeated failures to testify truthfully in the Jones lawsuit, something that has never once been levied against Trump by the Mueller team.
You seem pretty eager to definitively make statements when you're playing loose with the facts.
Settlements are for civil cases, not criminal cases. And that also isn't how it works. Settlements aren't an admittance of guilt, despite how much it may look like it. And they don't qualify as being charged with a crime.
I am not playing loose with any facts. My whole point isn't go down the Clinton rabbit hole, it is just to show that this idea Trump (or anyone) cant be charged with obstruction without being charged with another crime is false. Clinton, was not charged with anything but obstruction. That is a fact. You can argue he looked shady, and you believe he did this or that, and that is fine. It doesn't change the fact that he was charged with obstruction, without being charged with another crime.
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Dawg, I'm going to give you a life tip right now that you should probably know but are too stupid to play forward. You DO NOT want to get into a conversation where you go hard in the paint for "paying settlements prove guilt" when you're a Trump supporter.
I never said he CAN'T be, if you'd just re-read my initial post. I said it's just extremely difficult when the one single underlying crime being investigated, collusion, has turned out to be a nothingburger and no collusion was actually found.
And once again you've presented something as fact when it's not. Clinton was charged in the Senate with 2 charges, one being obstruction but the other being lying to a grand jury (perjury).
Article I charged that Clinton lied to the grand jury concerning:[21]
- the nature and details of his relationship with Lewinsky
- prior false statements he made in the Jones deposition
- prior false statements he allowed his lawyer to make characterizing Lewinsky's affidavit
- his attempts to tamper with witnesses
quality response.
its going to be awesome when that report is finally out. it will be funny when that extremely petty trump decides to do launch some investigations of his own.
I don't know how quality the response was, but you wanting to investigate a private organization for who they elected as their candidate is pretty nuts.
The president doesn't conduct investigations. Regardless, if we are going to play tit for tat with investigations then at some point we just have to consider the idea of what this country was meant to be has ran its course and is over. Investigations shouldn't be "petty", they should be about serious issues. You can say what you want about this investigation, but there were 37 indictments, 7 pleas, and 4 people already sentenced to prision. So it wasn't a witch hunt and it wasn't petty.
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Dude, there have been 7 guilty pleas, so I don't know how you can possibly say it was a nothingburger. If there is some indication Trump tried to interfere in the probe, he can most certainly be charged with obstruction. I am not saying he did and I am not saying he will be, but this idea it would be difficult or whatever, is simply not true.
I know what Clinton was charged with. You aren't getting my point, and maybe I am not making my point clear. Clinton was not charged with anything that didn't involve impeding the investigation, yet, he was not charged with any crimes outside of that. SO this idea that someone cant be charged with obstruction or anything similar, without another crime being present, simply isn't true.
7 guilty pleas that have nothing to do with collusion with Russia to interfere in the election. C'mon, this is not this hard.
It doesn't matter and that isn't the point. Again, I am not saying Trump will be or should be charged, I am just disputing your idea that it would be extremely difficult since he hasn't been charged with another crime. If there is evidence he tried to interfere with the investigation, he could most certainly be charged with obstruction, without being charged with another crime. That is all I am saying.
37 indictments, 7 please, and 4 people sentenced to prison. please tell me how many of those were directly related to russian collusion? you know the central tenat of the investigation.
you act like the russian collusion investigation wasnt a petty witch hunt. thats fine but dont be shocked when trumps fbi/doj start their own investigations that wont be petty witch hunts at all. lol
The investigation was to see if, and how, Russia interfered in our election. We know they at least attempted to, but until we read the report we don't know if they were successful or to what degree. It's amazing how another country trying to influence our election is somehow not considered a big deal to Republicans.
And Paul Manafort was charged with conspiring against the US. You cant possibly tell me a presidents campaign manager being charged with conspiring against the US (and other things) means nothing. Just because the investigation might not have found collusion, doesn't mean it was a pointless investigation. It found quite a few things.
I wont be shocked if Trump starts investigations. But again, we might as well call it a day on the good ole US of A if we are getting to a point where our politics is about revenge on opponents and nothing more.
https://thehill.com/policy/national-security/437102-house-panel-votes-to-subpoena-mueller-report
BREAKING NEWS: HOUSE DEMOCRATS VOTE TO APPROVE SUBPOENA FOR UNREDACTED MUELLER REPORT
by Kevin Ryan
The House Judiciary Committee has voted to authorize a subpoena for special counsel Robert Mueller’s report, unredacted, as well as all underlying evidence at a business meeting Wednesday morning. There is believed to be millions of pages of documents related to the 300+ page report.
Attorney General William Barr told lawmakers late last week that officials were on track to release the report with legally required redactions within the next two weeks or earlier. Existing law prohibits the release of any grand jury information or classified material, which the report is said to contain a significant amount of. Intelligence gathered on Russian operations to interfere with the 2016 election, for example, was likely compiled by confidential sources and/or electronic means, the public revelation of which would compromise those methods.
House Democrats are nevertheless demanding the immediate release of Mueller’s entire report — with NO redactions. Opponents of the Trump administration have been insinuating that Barr will use redactions to hide any information proving Trump/Russia collusion. Trump supporters point out that it’s unlikely that Robert Mueller, who is working with Barr to redact the report, would go along with any scheme by the attorney general to hide incriminating material.
The announcement of an impending House subpoena sets up a showdown between the Justice Department and House Democrats over release of the report without redactions.
BREAKING NEWS: HOUSE DEMOCRATS VOTE TO APPROVE SUBPOENA FOR UNREDACTED MUELLER REPORT
by Kevin Ryan
The House Judiciary Committee has voted to authorize a subpoena for special counsel Robert Mueller’s report, unredacted, as well as all underlying evidence at a business meeting Wednesday morning. There is believed to be millions of pages of documents related to the 300+ page report.
Attorney General William Barr told lawmakers late last week that officials were on track to release the report with legally required redactions within the next two weeks or earlier. Existing law prohibits the release of any grand jury information or classified material, which the report is said to contain a significant amount of. Intelligence gathered on Russian operations to interfere with the 2016 election, for example, was likely compiled by confidential sources and/or electronic means, the public revelation of which would compromise those methods.
House Democrats are nevertheless demanding the immediate release of Mueller’s entire report — with NO redactions. Opponents of the Trump administration have been insinuating that Barr will use redactions to hide any information proving Trump/Russia collusion. Trump supporters point out that it’s unlikely that Robert Mueller, who is working with Barr to redact the report, would go along with any scheme by the attorney general to hide incriminating material.
The announcement of an impending House subpoena sets up a showdown between the Justice Department and House Democrats over release of the report without redactions.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...ding-3-targetting-conspiracy-and-global-leaks
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/nu...concerning-leaks-conspiracy-amid-russia-probe
Nunes to send eight criminal referrals to DOJ concerning leaks, conspiracy amid Russia probe
Nunes said he has been working on the referrals for more than two years, and wanted to wait until the confirmation of Attorney General Bill Barr.
"We're prepared this week to notify the attorney general that we're prepared to send those referrals over," Nunes said. "First of all, all of these are classified or sensitive. ... Five of them are what I would call straight up referrals -- so just referrals that name someone and name the specific crimes," Nunes told Maria Bartiromo. "Those crimes are lying to Congress, misleading Congress, leaking classified information. So five of them are those types."
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/nu...concerning-leaks-conspiracy-amid-russia-probe
Nunes to send eight criminal referrals to DOJ concerning leaks, conspiracy amid Russia probe
Nunes said he has been working on the referrals for more than two years, and wanted to wait until the confirmation of Attorney General Bill Barr.
"We're prepared this week to notify the attorney general that we're prepared to send those referrals over," Nunes said. "First of all, all of these are classified or sensitive. ... Five of them are what I would call straight up referrals -- so just referrals that name someone and name the specific crimes," Nunes told Maria Bartiromo. "Those crimes are lying to Congress, misleading Congress, leaking classified information. So five of them are those types."
Whoopdie do. Nobody beyond the Trump butt-kissing Red Hatters thinks this is a story. Ol' Dev lost his Chairmanship of the Intelligence Committee after the last election. He's a House backbencher now. Nothing to see here.
I agree. Wait a sec, do you mean people like George Papadopoulos and Paul Manafort? They're already in jail.
We're still waiting to hear what happens to their law-breaking buddies Michael Flynn, Richard Gates, and Roger Stone.
you do realize i was ok with those people going to jail right? i dont care if they are right or left, i just want equal justice. you also realize they didnt have anything to do with russian collusion right?
Okay. In that case, my bad. I must have missed your pleasure that those crooks got sent to the slammer.
LMAO. Yeah, absolutely no collusion. Trump campaigners lied for no reason whatsoever.
Okay. In that case, my bad. I must have missed your pleasure that those crooks got sent to the slammer.
LMAO. Yeah, absolutely no collusion. Trump campaigners lied for no reason whatsoever.
LOL the Mueller report found no collusion LOL
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...fter-mueller-report-house-hearing/3400383002/
Barr used his first appearance before a House committee since the end of Mueller's investigation to offer a scattering of details about how he and other lawyers in his office were reviewing the nearly 400-page report summarizing the investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election. Barr told lawmakers that some parts of the report must remain secret because they contain grand-jury information or national security secrets, then pointedly declined to say more.
Barr declined to answer questions about the details of the special counsel's investigations or whether any of its findings had been shared with the White House.
"I'm not going to say anything more about it until the report is out," Barr said.
Barr used his first appearance before a House committee since the end of Mueller's investigation to offer a scattering of details about how he and other lawyers in his office were reviewing the nearly 400-page report summarizing the investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election. Barr told lawmakers that some parts of the report must remain secret because they contain grand-jury information or national security secrets, then pointedly declined to say more.
Barr declined to answer questions about the details of the special counsel's investigations or whether any of its findings had been shared with the White House.
"I'm not going to say anything more about it until the report is out," Barr said.
Following exactly what Nadler demanded be the standard in the 90's when commenting on Special Counsel protecting grand jury testimony. Bravo.
Thankfully Barr will now finally look into the role that the Obama lackey's at the FBI, DOJ, and anyone else involved in starting this entire Trump/Collusion hoax that shamefully occupied and wasted 2 years.
Barr made clear Tuesday that his review is distinct and more far-ranging than IG Horowitz’s investigation. It goes back to the moment when a probe code-named Crossfire Hurricane was opened on July 31, 2016, by Trump-hating FBI counterintelligence agent Peter Strzok.
That probe’s goal was to determine whether Trump was colluding with Russia to hijack the election. And, very quickly, the FBI chose to use an opposition research project, funded by Trump rival Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party and written by British intelligence operative Christopher Steele, as key evidence — even though it was unverified at the time.
Special counsel Robert Mueller has settled the collusion issue, concluding (like House and Senate intelligence committee Republicans before him) that there was no Trump-Russia conspiracy.
Barr made clear Tuesday that his review is distinct and more far-ranging than IG Horowitz’s investigation. It goes back to the moment when a probe code-named Crossfire Hurricane was opened on July 31, 2016, by Trump-hating FBI counterintelligence agent Peter Strzok.
That probe’s goal was to determine whether Trump was colluding with Russia to hijack the election. And, very quickly, the FBI chose to use an opposition research project, funded by Trump rival Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party and written by British intelligence operative Christopher Steele, as key evidence — even though it was unverified at the time.
Special counsel Robert Mueller has settled the collusion issue, concluding (like House and Senate intelligence committee Republicans before him) that there was no Trump-Russia conspiracy.
Remember in 2017 when Trump asserted that his campaign was spied on by Obama lackeys and lefties mocked him?
"I think spying did occur," Barr said. "I'm not talking about the FBI necessarily, but intelligence agencies more broadly," Barr said.
"I think spying on a political campaign is a big deal. I'm not suggesting those rules were violated but I think it's important to look at that," he continued. "The question is whether it was predicated, adequately predicated, and I'm not suggesting it wasn't adequately predicated, but I need to explore that."
"I think spying did occur," Barr said. "I'm not talking about the FBI necessarily, but intelligence agencies more broadly," Barr said.
"I think spying on a political campaign is a big deal. I'm not suggesting those rules were violated but I think it's important to look at that," he continued. "The question is whether it was predicated, adequately predicated, and I'm not suggesting it wasn't adequately predicated, but I need to explore that."
In his own words he's talking about "unauthorized surveillance." The FISA court authorized the surveillance on him and the FBI let him know in 2016 that his campaign was the target for Russian interference. Of course Trump already knew that because they had already been in contact with Russian spies at Trump Tower.
Barr is going to investigate and find that these Obama lackeys used the Clinton funded fake dossier to launch this whole thing and finally hold those accountable who led us on this hoax witch hunt for 2 years
No collusion and now we find that there was spying based upon partisan means. Disgrace
It’s going to bite them in the ass bigly
Remember that the cretin at the center of almost all of this is Petr Strokz, an FBI lackey who was paling around with a woman from Obama's DOJ. He's at the center of the bullshit FISA warrant that was obtained, knowingly, with paid opposition research that was unverified and had reason to not be believed. Which started this entire fake news, bullshit, hoax Russia collusion goosechase.
He's also the guy who directly intervened to get Comey to change the language regarding HRC's email crimes to make it less legally pressing to actually do something about it.
And now we know that Lisa Page, his gal pal at DOJ, testified to Congress that Loretta Lynch's DOJ was directly involved and guiding the FBI to not come to the conclusion that charges had to be brought in the HRC email scandal.
This all needs to be investigated and people need to be held accountable.
Sounds like you're describing the exact proper process for obtaining a warrant with probable cause. If investigators had rock solid evidence they wouldn't need warrant. In America probable cause is all you need to have to convince a judge. If they were dishonest that's one thing. It's the judges job to determine if the evidence is good enough for a warrant and it's the judges decision to make.
Nobody is saying the judge should be held accountable. The guy who made up a story to obtain a warrant should be.
Especially given they did not state that this was Clinton funded fake news opposition research in the request
This is as dirty as it gets
Unless the information was presented in a way that was dishonest there's no crime. You and I and everyone else have no clue about how it was presented. If evidence comes out that people acted inappropriately then by all means charge them.
The only reason most of the mouth breathing chuds think there's a crime is because Trump has been screeching about this with no evidence.
Wrong again . Anyone with one eye and half a brain could figure it out . They used a bulls hit dossier that they paid for as a basis for warrants . They knowingly used false information to further their petty bs investigation . If the police did this you loser lefties would be burning businesses and throwing rocks at police cars and other working folks . But since your team did it it’s no problem for you hypocrites
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