I know they are, that's kind of the point. I have nothing against conservatives. There are plenty of subjects I hold conservative views with. But what I can't stand is out right lies and fiction and that's all Trump and his supporters throw out.
Obama wiretapped Trump Tower during election...
- Thread starter Bob the Citronaut
- Start date
I know they are, that's kind of the point. I have nothing against conservatives. There are plenty of subjects I hold conservative views with. But what I can't stand is out right lies and fiction and that's all Trump and his supporters throw out.
Just in case any of ya'll (other than Trumpets, for obvious reasons) are interested in actual facts about this, DOJ just stated in a court case that they did not tap Trump's wires (despite his tweets otherwise). So unless the DOJ is willing to perjure themselves in a court filling, we can add this to the embarassingly long list of lies told by Trump.
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-russia-investigation-wiretap-fbi-obama-658888
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-russia-investigation-wiretap-fbi-obama-658888
I'm still waiting for the truth to be published about the unmasking.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/18/politics/paul-manafort-government-wiretapped-fisa-russians/index.html
US investigators wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort under secret court orders before and after the election.
US investigators wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort under secret court orders before and after the election.
What a coincidence that the FBI stopped wiretapping due to lack of evidence, and then magically, they get a new warrant to resume wiretapping right at the time when he becomes the Trump campaign chair.
I'm skeptical of FISA. There's a 99.7% acceptance rate on over 35k requests - either there's a lot of cases where it's warranted (about 1k per year) or it's basically a rubber stamp. Without oversight, it's difficult to say which.
It started out as just a few dozen a year and has ballooned into a few dozen a week. At this pace, one secret judge in DC will be approving hundreds per day at a 99.7 percent rate before Scott Frost leaves for Nebraska. You get a warrant and you get a warrant....
Maybe it's legit and I'm just paranoid, but secret courts without oversight ruling whether you should lose your Constitutional right is a little concerning.
The 1k per year is for FISA surveillance and it's back loaded with closer to 1500 per year currently. Supposedly there are also National Security Letters for about 5500 citizens per year where the government is requesting customer records from banks, ISPs, etc.
I don't think it's a difficult ask to have oversight. I'm not asking to see the classified material, I understand the need for secrecy. But for a citizen to give up a constitutional right, there needs to be checks and oversight of the process.
Famous last words.
Remember how the federal watch lists -- like the No Fly and Terrorist Watch Lists -- were originally small too? They have gone from useful to a 'turn in your neighbor' list.
Indeed. I think CNN owes Trump a huge apology on this one.
As a Libertarian, I'm all for holding all politicians accountable. But it's starting to, once again, looking more like political retribution.
Citizen rights?? You are so like yesterday. You have an executive that used the IRS as a hammer against normal citizens,
This is the new America where only illegals have rights.
Very sad, but true.
Bill Clinton did this in the '90s as well. He was notorious for using the IRS audit as a threat, often enough that even those in his administration admit to it to this day. Bill Clinton also used it to the effect of being anti-small business. It's much easier to extract 'new revenue' from small businesses because A) they are domestic and B) they don't have lawyers in on staff.
As we found out during the hearings in the late '90s, the IRS used illegal tactics to extract revenue they were not entitled to. I know, they got my father, and I saw it first-hand. It went on for nearly 5 years before it was stopped.
Now this last time around, when Barack Obama pulled the same non-sense, small businesses remembered everything they learned from the Clinton hearings. So it wasn't even one revenue year before they started fighting back. They A) immediately leveraged their associations, B) contacted their Republican representatives and, if they operated in a Republican controlled state, C) contacted their state comptrollers and other entities.
One of the ways Florida corporations and businesses fought the IRS was to have the state question any IRS agent who was not accepting any valid Florida state write-offs as legitimate expenses. In other words, the IRS was now accusing the business of committing fraud in its filings with the state of Florida as well, which then caused the IRS to come under scrutiny from the state of Florida.
Another was the Republicans turning this into a politically charged fight, as the overwhelming majority of small businesses are Republican. Indeed, the IRS was specifically targeting small businesses with political contributions, which were overwhelmingly Republican. So it provided a key, partisan charge that now put the administration on the defensive. Regardless of whether or not it was purposefully partisan or not didn't matter.
Republicans, once again and like under Clinton, were getting targeted, and heavily so. This is why the claims that businesses owned by registered Democratic voters or even political contributions were dismissed as minor and irrelevant.
Ironically, this is not far from the truth. They do have more rights than many citizens.
And the best 'enforcer' in a crime syndicate is an undocumented resident. They are also responsible for 99% of all unlawful, fully automatic weapon discharges. People don't like to face those realities, especially the Brady Foundation, who's CDC and FBI-based statistics, ignore the fact that organized crime is responsible for nearly all of those, and nearly all of those are not by US citizens or legal, green card or visa holders.
The domain of gun violence has always been organized crime. And given citizens and legal residence have become completely tracked, the elements of organize crime -- especially the 'enforcer' aspects -- have become completely non-legal resident as a result.
Most undocumented residents then become victims and 'standby participants,' because they live in fear, and cannot work with law enforcement. Their children then become tied up into it, which then becomes a circular issue.
Which is why we're seeing some of their estranged children become gang members, etc..., etc..., etc...
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Ah yes, like the illegals who were arrested at the hospital because their 2 year old child needed life saving medical care.
Are those the rights you are talking about? Some of ya'll huffed a bit too much lead in your childhood.
not sure why you would think illegal aliens would have the same rights as a us citizen.
Are you seriously trying to appear stupid? Is this your debate tactic? Haven't you learned your lesson from every other thread where you post stupid shit and then get embarassed?
Where did I say I think illegal aliens should have the same rights as a US citizen? I was responding to goodknights completely idiotic claim that illegals "have more rights than US citizens".
More rights? No. Of course not. Not now anyways.
However, the fact remains that one of our 2 major political parties in this country is actively attempting to solidify a degradation of the rule of law and to reward illegal aliens for breaking the law. It was just yesterday that Nancy Pelosi declared that the "dreamer" parents "did a great thing" in bringing them to the US. In other words, Pelosi used a congressional press conference to actively praise and encourage illegal immigration.
There's also the fact that left wing cesspools such as California ARE taking steps to grant illegal aliens with the same rights as citizens.
Goodknight when way overboard with his comment, but please don't try either to whitewash the fact that the left wing in this country is actively attempting to assure that illegal criminal aliens receive full rights as citizens without having to do anything in return.
I'm not really seeing where I tried to whitewash any left wing illegal criminal aliens rights, I do see where I pointed out the idiocracy of goodknight's and then UCFWayne's statements.
It was some simple hyperbole. Damn, you can really be an asshole. Do you stare at yourself in the mirror while you masturbate?
This coming from someone who couldn't pick up on my obvious hyperbole regarding business majors and statistics.
Not to mention hyperbole actually has to be based in truth for it to make sense. Look, I'm sorry I made you look foolish too since evidently you liked his idiotic post, I understand it can be embarrassing.
People have told me I'm good enough looking to masturbate to, but they are usually female. I appreciate the sentiments either way Fab. You really do put the Fab in Fabulous.
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Obama 1-26
Thou shalt trust Washington insiders and elites in a decisions made to protect Washington and the insiders and elites. They are unquestionably honorable, honest, and free of envy, and would never use govt power brokers like the IRS against citizens.
That's my problem with Bernie Sanders.
The VA hearings pretty much proved to me that Bernie Sanders can do nothing when Embezzlement was obvious, but the federal unions will ensure no charges will be brought against even low-level, federal employees ... much more politicians ... let alone none will lose any jobs.
In the private sector, those people would have no only been fired, but prosecuted, criminally.
Can't refute any of my arguments so going with masturbation jokes. I wonder who made the correct argument?
I'm merely appreciating two of the most honest and hilarious depictions of you that I've seen on this board.
You should use this as an opportunity to reflect on these posts and change accordingly
Why should I change? Because a couple people that still think masturbation jokes are an adequate comeback yet literally had no clue how the 1st amendment work are butthurt? It is hilarious how much you overestimate how much I care about your collective opinion.
Well, multiple people posted those things, and others liked that post, yet you only really responded with anger once I mentioned it. Seems you do care about my opinion?
Where did I respond with anger? I was the first one to like the picture, it was pretty funny. Extra funny when you consider how butthurt Wayne is considering that's the best he can come up in response after being absolutely embarrassed in his drivers license thread.
I think you are projecting again.
So...any actual evidence about those wiretaps? LMAO just more insane bullshit from deranged Trump and his MAGAts.
Obama didn't wiretap you Trump, your own lawyer did because he knew you are a slimy piece of shit.
Obama didn't wiretap you Trump, your own lawyer did because he knew you are a slimy piece of shit.
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