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PAC 12 schools meeting with BIG 12?

the real goal is to get to P3 setup.

In a Big 18 there is no PAC. This drives up the price for Big 18. So those same 6 that could get $30 to $40 million with Oregon St, WSU and Cal would be $50+ in Big 18 with FOX, ESPN, CBS, and NBC all having some interest.

A Big 18 under FOX is a problem for ESPN. They’d be forced to win, or try to win, in order to eventually liquidate ACC, and to prevent FOX from having equal mass.

NBC needs it to be able to build value for its ND plans if they lose out in BIG. CBS needs some T1 to replace SEC.
A better strategy is not to extend too much now with too many teams from the PAC (that is bad for us BTW) and have room left after the SEC or B10 figure out how the ACC can be broken up and get some left overs these to have a good division in the East.

Just because you can have 8-10 PAC teams, doesn't mean we should....that is why they can't get a good media deal now....too many low revue potential teams.

The more the center of gravity moves West, the more vulnerable we are.
 
A better strategy is not to extend too much now with too many teams from the PAC (that is bad for us BTW) and have room left after the SEC or B10 figure out how the ACC can be broken up and get some left overs these to have a good division in the East.

Just because you can have 8-10 PAC teams, doesn't mean we should....that is why they can't get a good media deal now....too many low revue potential teams.

The more the center of gravity moves West, the more vulnerable we are.
Big 18 was said multiple times. That’s the strategy. Not a full merger. Where are you getting 10? Are you resorting to strawman?

A Big 18 is room for 6 ACC, but likely more since it’s unlikely P2 expansion only occurs in the east. Potentially as much as room for 9 ACC imo.

A bigger question is whether there will be 6 ACC schools of value given getting out of the GOR likely comes with transaction costs of a couple undeserving ACC schools getting in.

But the first step is getting rid of PAC. If that takes 6-8, you do it. Stanford isn’t going to be in the Big 12 long even if they agreed. Going independent and being included with P2 like ND is, is better for them. But if they do stay, that helps lure the ACC schools of most value
 
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How unrealistic is this Big 24?

West 12
UW, Oregon, Utah, BYU, CU, KSU
AZ, ASU, Tech, TCU, Ok St, Iowa State

East 12
KU, Louisville, Cincinnati, Pitt, WVU, VT
Baylor, Houston, UCF, Miami, GT, NCSt

It assumes BIG stops with ND and Stanford, SEC takes Clemson, FSU, UNC, UVa.

I’m not sure what happens to Duke. Maybe the next round they get picked up with KU.

If more ACC schools go to P2, I’m inclined to go Cuse or BC or USF for rivalry purposes. Hate is great for conferences, and there are a lot of Big East lineage there.

If UW and Oregon are out, I’m not sure we go west. Cal isn’t getting you anything in west coast if 5 are BIG. I’d rather add those former Big East schools and move Baylor and KU to west.

The key is, that adds all the schools outside the P2 that either have P5 era social capital, or can be like UCF and compete at the very top level with little help. I mean, UCF on $50 million conference revenue? That’s like getting $75-$80 million in Nebraska. That 24 is too good and too big to ignore. If it breaks apart into competing conferences, I think we’re forgotten

Boise ST has ratings but they’ll have to prove they can be an issue in the beefed up MWC. SDSU should have UCF/Houston type potential, but the west coast too apathetic. Memphis? Maybe. If they join MWC with SMU, Oregon St, WSU that’s a good G5
 
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So a proposed strategy is to wait till somebody else does something? Kind of sounds like the old Big XII that left them close to dead.
 
So a proposed strategy is to wait till somebody else does something? Kind of sounds like the old Big XII that left them close to dead.
The guy said the B12 was open for business, not open for bad business and foolish decisions. We will have to wait out the media negotiations to get the best teams possible....totally sure we could get Ore St, Wash St, and Cal to sign immediately.
 
the real goal is to get to P3 setup.

In a Big 18 there is no PAC. This drives up the price for Big 18. So those same 6 that could get $30 to $40 million with Oregon St, WSU and Cal would be $50+ in Big 18 with FOX, ESPN, CBS, and NBC all having some interest.

A Big 18 under FOX is a problem for ESPN. They’d be forced to win, or try to win, in order to eventually liquidate ACC, and to prevent FOX from having equal mass.

NBC needs it to be able to build value for its ND plans if they lose out in BIG. CBS needs some T1 to replace SEC.
It's a good time to have 4 networks bidding for your content
 
Bottom line is we are going to raid the Pac for 4 teams, maybe 6- AZ, AZS, CO, UT and maybe OU and UW. The Big 10 and SEC will devour the ACC. We will get what is left.
 
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Bottom line is we are going to raid the Pac for 4 teams, maybe 6- AZ, AZS, CO, UT and maybe OU and UW. The Big 10 and SEC will devour the ACC. We will get what is left.
This scenario (6 or more PAC schools) is not in UCF's best interest. The conference needs more teams in the East. Take 4 PAC schools and save four places for the ACC teams like LVille, NC St, GT, Pitt etc.
 
The guy said the B12 was open for business, not open for bad business and foolish decisions. We will have to wait out the media negotiations to get the best teams possible....totally sure we could get Ore St, Wash St, and Cal to sign
So wait for somebody else to make moves like the old Big XII, instead of weakening the PAC then wait for the better PAC to come calling.
 
So wait for somebody else to make moves like the old Big XII, instead of weakening the PAC then wait for the better PAC to come calling.
LOL, how is the PAC going to be "better" assuming we could get 4 of their teams? Instead of making dumb moves just to sign the first 4 teams that raise their hand, we get the best 4 teams we can. Not talking about a year from now, all this should be settled in 60 days. In a rough pecking order, this is how I see the desirability:

1. O (#1 but I expect them to get the call when the P2 goes to 20 teams)
2. Wash
3. Utah
4. Az St (despite the current infractions)
5. Stanford (great pick up for a number of reasons but they may not be interested)
6. Colorado (their program is a mess, saw an interview with their beat writer who only sees 2 wins this year)
7. Az
8. Wash St (some people see them higher based on viewership numbers)
9. Ore St
10. Cal (would be higher except for their politics)
 
This scenario (6 or more PAC schools) is not in UCF's best interest. The conference needs more teams in the East. Take 4 PAC schools and save four places for the ACC teams like LVille, NC St, GT, Pitt etc.


There is room for 6, easily. There won’t be more than 6 ACC schools of value available if they’re getting past the GOR anytime soon.

And if the P2 is 40 or less, it means the 3rd is 24. The smaller the P2, the bigger the P3 has to be to get exclusivity and the other guy role

Then you add the fact that further P2 expansion likely is not only involving ACC schools, and that 18 isn’t really 18, and there is likely to be 1-3 more spots for ACC.

Think strategically here, not one move at a time. The best way to get 4+ schools in the east is to kill the PAC and becoming Big 18

imo even Big 20 is doable because of how unlikely it is the ACC loses enough schools to P2 but nothing occurs with Stanford, UW etc
 
There is room for 6, easily. There won’t be more than 6 ACC schools of value available if they’re getting past the GOR anytime soon.

And if the P2 is 40 or less, it means the 3rd is 24. The smaller the P2, the bigger the P3 has to be to get exclusivity and the other guy role

Then you add the fact that further P2 expansion likely is not only involving ACC schools, and that 18 isn’t really 18, and there is likely to be 1-3 more spots for ACC.

Think strategically here, not one move at a time. The best way to get 4+ schools in the east is to kill the PAC and becoming Big 18

imo even Big 20 is doable because of how unlikely it is the ACC loses enough schools to P2 but nothing occurs with Stanford, UW etc
Yeah, we are just going to have to disagree....even if a P3 went to 40 schools, the income per school is just watered down.

At this moment and for the near future, the magic number is 16. If we take the best 4 PAC schools we can, the PAC becomes a G6. Then let the P2 do the heavy lifting to break up the ACC, then scoop up the best leftovers.
 
Better hope everyone in the Big XII (especially any additions) signs a new grant of rights locking them in to the conference before negotiating a new media deal. Any school (Oregon, UW) balking at signing a gor has one foot out the door and shouldn’t be added. I don’t see Oregon or UW signing a gor limiting them or keeping them in…so it seems the four corner schools add the most value while practically turning the PAC 12 Into the American for their next TV deal.

No current Big XII school is an expansion candidate for the Big 10 or SEC.. so signing a new gor provides stability and enhances the conference’s ability to negotiate a new media deal. screw Oregon and UW, they’ll always think they deserve a bigger share of the revenue and act like Texas did in the conference.
 
Yeah, add Utah, Colorado, Arizona State and U and lock this bitch up for 10 years. I doubt any ACC schools are gonna climb on board anytime soon.
 
Better hope everyone in the Big XII (especially any additions) signs a new grant of rights locking them in to the conference before negotiating a new media deal. Any school (Oregon, UW) balking at signing a gor has one foot out the door and shouldn’t be added. I don’t see Oregon or UW signing a gor limiting them or keeping them in…so it seems the four corner schools add the most value while practically turning the PAC 12 Into the American for their next TV deal.

No current Big XII school is an expansion candidate for the Big 10 or SEC.. so signing a new gor provides stability and enhances the conference’s ability to negotiate a new media deal. screw Oregon and UW, they’ll always think they deserve a bigger share of the revenue and act like Texas did in the conference.
They are talking about a 7 year GOR, which is OK but 5 would be better for UCF, which I think has more breakout potential than any B12 school

I assume O wouldn't sign, but Wash should....they won't be very sought after.
 
The guy said the B12 was open for business, not open for bad business and foolish decisions. We will have to wait out the media negotiations to get the best teams possible....totally sure we could get Ore St, Wash St, and Cal to sign immediately.
I don't think Cal would sign unless they had too. Besides they really don't spend much on their football program anymore.
 
LOL, how is the PAC going to be "better" assuming we could get 4 of their teams? Instead of making dumb moves just to sign the first 4 teams that raise their hand, we get the best 4 teams we can. Not talking about a year from now, all this should be settled in 60 days. In a rough pecking order, this is how I see the desirability:

1. O (#1 but I expect them to get the call when the P2 goes to 20 teams)
2. Wash
3. Utah
4. Az St (despite the current infractions)
5. Stanford (great pick up for a number of reasons but they may not be interested)
6. Colorado (their program is a mess, saw an interview with their beat writer who only sees 2 wins this year)
7. Az
8. Wash St (some people see them higher based on viewership numbers)
9. Ore St
10. Cal (would be higher except for their politics)
Start the process, get a couple of teams, then wait for the better to come calling. Guess you mis-interpreted me saying the PAC would get better.
 
LOL, how is the PAC going to be "better" assuming we could get 4 of their teams? Instead of making dumb moves just to sign the first 4 teams that raise their hand, we get the best 4 teams we can. Not talking about a year from now, all this should be settled in 60 days. In a rough pecking order, this is how I see the desirability:

1. O (#1 but I expect them to get the call when the P2 goes to 20 teams)
2. Wash
3. Utah
4. Az St (despite the current infractions)
5. Stanford (great pick up for a number of reasons but they may not be interested)
6. Colorado (their program is a mess, saw an interview with their beat writer who only sees 2 wins this year)
7. Az
8. Wash St (some people see them higher based on viewership numbers)
9. Ore St
10. Cal (would be higher except for their politics)
So you're process is to wait till after maybe they are uncomfortable with the new TV contract, IF it happens, rather than trying to chip away and make the TV channel uncomfortable with the PAC. OK, no problem. Wait and see sometimes works. Hasn't for the last few years of the XII, but maybe it works now. I'd rather try to destroy the PAC by taking 2, make it appear they're weak. If we were honest, any (in reality) crap PAC team is far more respected by twit talking heads than the last 4 the Big XII added. Yes, it's probably not reality, but the majority of viewers/ESPN blabbers really only want to watch/talk about the same teams they've been talking about for the last decade. Point being, 2 different approaches, wait for a chance of something good happening, or the other, try to prod it into happening. My choice, try to end the PAC and be the only viable option for the better teams to come around.
 
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Interesting little thread about ND potentially working to get Stanford and Cal into the Big XII. Of course this would have implications for OR and WA too. MHver3 points out that ND can't be trusted because they used the Big XII in bad faith for a past round of negotiations.

 
So you're process is to wait till after maybe they are uncomfortable with the new TV contract, IF it happens, rather than trying to chip away and make the TV channel uncomfortable with the PAC. OK, no problem. Wait and see sometimes works. Hasn't for the last few years of the XII, but maybe it works now. I'd rather try to destroy the PAC by taking 2, make it appear they're weak. If we were honest, any (in reality) crap PAC team is far more respected by twit talking heads than the last 4 the Big XII added. Yes, it's probably not reality, but the majority of viewers/ESPN blabbers really only want to watch/talk about the same teams they've been talking about for the last decade. Point being, 2 different approaches, wait for a chance of something good happening, or the other, try to prod it into happening. My choice, try to end the PAC and be the only viable option for the better teams to come around.
I'm not concerned with the new commissioner taking over. He announced they are open for business. From his comments during media days I believe they are aggressively looking at all the scenarios and running the numbers before bringing in any teams. I would be concerned if old Bowlsby, was still in charge. He was the one that passively sat on his hands
 
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Cal? Yuck, bad program, bad politics which they are so vocal about........last we heard they would refuse to travel to BYU.

Substitute Utah, and I’m fine with those 4. I can only assume Az state is being turned away from the club by the bouncers because of NCAA trouble.
 
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Why would ND help anybody but themselves?

Someone help here since I don't know the connections. Why would you (the Big XII) bother to listen to ND, since they'd never want to join it?

It's like Scarlett Johannson calling you to beg you to start dating Lena Dunham.
This is all part of the story of ND asking a tv partner for 75 million per year. ND isn't worth that much on their own so they need to align with a conference for shoulder programming. Some believe the ACC is losing ground in their partnership with ND. I'm under the impression ND wants Stanford because they have history.
 
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Why would ND help anybody but themselves?
Agreed, any relationship of ND with B12 will be 10x worse than what it was between Texas and B12. ND would be seeing this as an opportunity to pocket the vast majority of the money leaving pennies for the rest and hoping the conference will be ok with it because now they can claim ND is with them.

Makes it look like ND is trying to show B10 they don't need them, and in the end they will unless a conference caves into their demands.
 
i disagree on ND. ND is looking for 75 mil from NBC while Big is about to get 100ish mil per school. The only team in the Big worth as much as ND is Oh State. With 7 home games per year ND would be getting just over 10 mil per game. You add to that the ACC BB/all sports and they would be close to Big 10 $$. As for B12 deal it would end up a stand alone NBC deal that compliments ND. I don't for a minute think the B12 is going to get 10 mil per game. But 6 or 7 may be doable for both parties. At the end of the day if B12 can get 55+ mil per school with escalators built in it will be golden. I am fine with 4 or 6 adds right now as long as we get the Money on new TV deal.
 
I think this is the very definition of “all hat and no cattle.” I say let them wallow in their own irrelevance. They seem to enjoy their place as the doormat of the conference. Why would they move to a demonstrably much more competitive conference? If any school has a JUCO level product it’s CU. They are already the laughing stock of the PAC, why would they want to move to become the laughing stock of the Big 12? I have a simple question for the CU administration. Project much?
 
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I think this is the very definition of “all hat and no cattle.” I say let them wallow in their own irrelevance. They seem to enjoy their place as the doormat of the conference. Why would they move to a demonstrably much more competitive conference? If any school has a JUCO level product it’s CU. They are already the laughing stock of the PAC, why would they want to move to become the laughing stock of the Big 12? I have a simple question for the CU administration. Project much?
Thats a really damaging quote. I wonder if it was made before the PAC lost the LA market, or is that individual that out of touch.
 
Thats a really damaging quote. I wonder if it was made before the PAC lost the LA market, or is that individual that out of touch.
Little story with context for the JUCO comment.
 
Colorado left the B12 previously because they were unhappy with the conference. Not surprising their administration is not excited to go back. In a world where Big 12 imploded, UCF administration wouldn't be all excited about reuniting with AAC.
 
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Thats comical. Boulder snobs
As a Big XII Conference historian, that's 'par for the course' for the elitist CU Administration.

Back when the Big XII was created, the members of the old Big 8 thought they were expanding their powerhouse league to include Texas and its homies. The thinking at the time was that the Big 8's old guard was still firmly in control. But, low and behold, once the expansion took place, the high-brow CU Administration decided they were more aligned with Texas than their former 'unwashed' bretheren in the Big 8.

Sooooooo....once the dust had settled on the announcement, the conference voted to ---- move its traditional headquarters from Kansas City, MO to Dallas, TX ----- do away with decades-old Big 8 records and 'start fresh' ---- do away with partial qualifers that helped programs like NE and OU ---- and play its championship games in Texas. So much for the naive notion that Big 8 officials had that they had simply expanded their league.

If there's a moral to this story for you guys and your new Big XII buddies, it's this: Be veeeeeeeeery suspicious if Notre Dame comes calling with a deal that sounds too damn good to be true.
 
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